Rebuild engine or buy a new one?

[Tatey]

This thought has been running through my head for a while now. To rebuild my 1.8 CVH engine i'd be looking at spending £150-£200 for the following parts:

• Engine degreaser - £5
• Engine paint - £6
• Piston rings - £32.50
• Big end bearings - £17.50
• Head gasket set - £30.50
• Head skim - £20
• Oil - £20
• Spark Plugs - £10
• Thermostat - £5
• Oil filter - £5
• Timing Belt - £10
• Sump Gasket - £8.46
• Core Plug Set - £7.50
• Air Filter
• HT Leads - £12

When i got the engine i was told it was a dud, once i stripped it down i found out it blew its head gasket meaning it needs a skim and the big end bearings are through to the copper. I dont know how many miles the engine has done.

After having a look on ebay i've discovered i can buy a new engine for around £150, which i'll know how many miles its done and if it actually was running before it was taken out. I stumbled across this 1.6 zetec engine:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Ford-Escort-1-6-Zetec-ENGINE-1994_W0QQitemZ350174870665QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Ca rsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item51880c7c89#h t_1966wt_939

Which was built in 1994 meaning emissions wouldn't be an issue. Although I wouldnt be buying this engine as i dont have the money at the moment, im just using it as an example but Im eventually planning on upgrading to a zetec engine, so thought, why put all of this money into my 1.8 CVH and just go straight for a zetec, i could also sell parts from my CVH to help fund it. I do know i'll need to buy bike carbs and megasquirt/megajolt to get it running, but i was possibly going to be going down this route with my CVH anyway.

What are peoples thoughts on this?

[HandyAndy]

tough decision to make,

if you spend the money on the cvh then at least you,ll know you have a rebuilt engine that should last a while, ;)

if you buy a 2nd hand zetec, they may say it was running fine but you have no way of knowing for sure :confused:

Or go all out & buy a new zetec engine for approx £700 plus extra bits to get it running (carbs,megajolt etc), then you know for sure the engine is spot on, with lots of power & may probably cost the same as rebuilding your current engine + the cost of when you eventually swap to a zetec anyway in the future.:cool:

me personally if i was in your shoes would go for the latter,
but as i know my cvh runs ( drove the donor car) then i,m going to use it,

Hey Simon, not sure when you hope to finish your car but depending on timing my cvh might be available by next christmas when i plan to install a zetec myself ;)

andy

[Tatey]

The zetec idea has played on my mind a few times, but what about the cat i'd need since the engine would be newer than Aug 1995?

[HandyAndy]

i,m not "up" with the cat stuff but lots of folk install newer engines that need a cat , i,m sure its not too difficult to achieve & if sourced on the 2nd hand market might not cost much either, maybe a cat bike exhaust /sensor would do the job?

or wait till next christmas for an engine ;) :)

cheers
andy

[Bonzo]

Personally, I would be very reluctant to spend a pile of wonga on an engine that is not my first or final choice.

I have found from past experience that engine rebuilding often turns into a money pit :eek:

The list of work that you have proposed will cost a fair amount of money + you'll probably need extras such as new water pump, timing belt tensioner, spark plugs, clutch ??
The final list could be endless !!

---------------------------------------

Here's some food for thought

If a brand new Zetec engine is out of reach at the moment

Why not have a look arround locally for an earlier Mk5 escort fitted with the 1.8 Zetec Silvertop engine. ( J, K, L reg, )
A J or early K plate will most likely not have PATS fitted, this may open the way to using the Escorts ECU ??

A MOT failure would be ideal & should not cost you a fortune

Remove the engine, loom, ECU, etc. Take the remains to the breakers, probably get at least £50 for it.

The 1.8 Zetec Silvertop is not a bad budget choice.
Alloy sump that could be used, as is if you wanted
Lighter flywheel than the 2 litre version
Fair bit more power than the CVH if you mangage to find the 115BHP GTI version + a little more power if you fit it with a pair of 2 litre cams :)

Once you have fitted a budget Zetec, the swap to a later Zetec 2 litre Blacktop shoud be a lot more straightforward as most of the hard work has been done + you'll have the parts needed for Blacktop conversion to hand ;)

[Tatey]

What would the complete cost be to install a brand new 2.0 zetec. Im talking even little things. Where is the best place to buy the engine from? What mods need to be done to install it? I could delay my build while i get enough money to put in a brand new engine.

Also how much you think i'd get for parts of a 1.8cvh? Im planning on cleaning everything up, i know i wont get much for it as a hole engine since its blown its headgasket and nothing is known about it.

Also what problems might i encounter on my build if im having to wait until i have the funds to buy the engine? Im close to finishing the chassis now. So the next thing will be to get the chassis rolling, and then what is the next stage? If it means installing the engine, will it be possible to skip that part and move onto another stage of the build until i have an engine?

[Bonzo]

I have not looked into the full cost of buying & fitting a brand new engine but would imagine the total cost would be at least £1 - £1500 depending on the choice of fueling

If you are wanting a top end ECU you can add another £500 -£750 :eek:

I have no idea as to the value of CVH parts.........My own was weighed in for scrap, shame really as it was a low milage good runner :(

Once your chassis is built, I am sure that you can find plenty of jobs to do whilst you are saving for an engine.

Fabricate all the wishbones, clean & overhaull some of the donor parts, put the floor in, seat mounts, roll bar etc :) :)

[Tatey]

I think i've come to a decision. It is to wait and see what i think of HandyAndy's car once its finished :p , if i like the speed then i'll be rebuilding my 1.8 CVH, if i prefer Spud69's car then ill be going for a brand new zetec engine. As i've just been going on the point that more power = better, which i may not actually find it to be, the slower i go the more mistakes i can make :D. And a few people who have upgraded from a 1.8 CVH to a 2.0 zetec say there wasnt as much difference than they hoped, and that to me isnt worth £800 more.

In the mean time i'll continue cleaning up the parts, but not spending any money doing so and researching the zetec engine.

[HandyAndy]

good idea Simon

i best get cracking on my own car then eh???? :D at the mo i,m making bits for everyone else,s :) :eek:
not a bad life really......spending every day building Roadsters :cool:

my cvh might need a new home next year ,

cheers
andy

[flyerncle]

My humble opinion,not pointed at you either Simon.More power you have the quicker you get into trouble and the quicker it all happens and I think it may turn a brilliant design into a Frankenstein horror story that is undrivable.

And thanks for the bits,busy as hell so sorry did not have more time.

[Rik178m]

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=126444&page=&contribmessage=none

Maybe of interest??

[davidimurray]

Personally - I would say continue with the CVH. You will have a known good engine, you will learn loads about engines and rebuilding them, you will have a big smile on your face at the end. Also a lot of the itmes you list you will probably need for the Zetec route anywya, or while the engine was out of the car you would be tempted to do some bits - e.g.

• Engine degreaser - £5
• Engine paint - £6
• Oil - £20
• Spark Plugs - £10
• Thermostat - £5 - possbily while you've got the chance
• Oil filter - £5
• Timing Belt - £10 - possbily while you've got the chance
• Sump Gasket - £8.46 - does the sump need chopping on the Zetec?
• Air Filter
• HT Leads - £12 - depends on your ignition setup

Also worth shopping around for prices on bits - head gasket sets look to be on ebay for about £20

[Tatey]

I have to say i think i am leaning more towards the CVH sides of things due to:

a) More of an experience rebuilding it
b) I'm a poor student at the moment, so the cheaper it is the quicker i can get it on the road
c) I'll be recycling :p
d) It will be a better step-up since I'm an inexperienced driver
e) I can always upgrade in the future
f) Satisfaction of getting a non runner running.
g) I can spread the cost over a much longer period.

But i've still got a while to decide as i'll be finishing my chassis, making wishbones/uprights and then getting the car rolling, so i may change my mind again :p

[thwang]

personlly i would rebuild the engine you have as lest you know its a good engine.my mate at works just bought a new engine for his focus from a chap in doncaster breakeryard it was sold as a goodun but its foobard and the guy wont give him his money back or accept the engine back

[Land Locked]

I have to say i think i am leaning more towards the CVH sides of things due to:

a) More of an experience rebuilding it
b) I'm a poor student at the moment, so the cheaper it is the quicker i can get it on the road
c) I'll be recycling :p
d) It will be a better step-up since I'm an inexperienced driver
e) I can always upgrade in the future
f) Satisfaction of getting a non runner running.
g) I can spread the cost over a much longer period.

But i've still got a while to decide as i'll be finishing my chassis, making wishbones/uprights and then getting the car rolling, so i may change my mind again :p

I find points A,C,F&G really appealing. There's a huge amount of satisfaction to be had from making a non runner run. I'm on a tight budget myself and being able to spread the cost over a longer time is important.