Advice needed from fellow builders
 

After reading the welding post on here I could use some advice regarding buying a welder.

First off i have a machine mart vat free day coming up and was going to buy myself a welder to assist with building my roadster.

i will only be doing little bits of welding as i am getting a fully welded chassis so will only have the extras to weld on.

does anyone have any advice reagrding clarke machines as i am absolutely clueless when it comes to welders and have looked at the following.

clarke mig 196 turbo
clarke 160 en turbo
clarke 151 en turbo
150 te turbo
151 te turbo

does anyone have any opinions on these or even if i can get better for the same money.

thanks in advance and sorry for the long post :)

Although I have not personally used any of the Clarke range of MIG welders, I do know that they are a very popular hobby machine & come highly recommended by users :)

To keep it simple, the higher the model number, the more powerful it is ( As a general rule of thumb )

If you only want to do a few odd jobs on your chassis, I would imagine that any of the Clarke 150** range should provide enough power to do the job. ;)

No point in spending too much on a welder if it is only going to be used for a few one off jobs.
That said, You may get a liking for welding or perhaps have other projects in mind, if that's the case it may pay to spend the extra money on a more powerful machine.

Thanks for the advice Bonzo i have no other plan for the welder other than for the bits that are needed on the chassis.

Anybody with any opinions on use of these machines

I have a Clarke 160 TM Welder. Its works great. Takes full sized gas bottles and 15kg wire rolls. Has a better torch on it, so spares can be sought from anywhere, not just clarke.

The likes of a 151 en is that they take hobby gas (expensive and doesn't last long) and that spares all need to come from clarke, so can be expensive. You can buy a new regulator to change it to standard gas bottles. But you might as well buy a better machine to start off with.

Incidentally they all weld up to around 150amps regardless of the name on them (excluding the 195TM, but at that money I'd get a proper mig welder, like a portamig). You can look at the Mig Welding Forum for some good advice.

From another forum.

Cool Which Hobby MIG to Buy???
OK, you have decided you are gonna take the plunge, have a go & buy yourself a small Hobby MIG; which make to buy?? (As this is a UK based site this is aimed at UK buyers & other countries will have other options).
There is now an ever growing number of brands to choose from but I will base this on 'The Big 4 Brands' in the UK which I have had hands-on experience in selling AND, more importantly, servicing & repairing.
These are my own OPINION's (for you legal eagles out there!)

SIP
+ Points:- Very widely available so parts are never a problem. Good performance on low settings. (25amps low setting)
- Points:- Wire feed assembly is poor & gives really annoying problems with age. The Torch connection to the machine is also very vunerable to damage which can also cause ALL kinds of problems.
OVERALL: 5/10

SEALEY
+ Points:- Again, available everywhere so parts never a problem. Seem to perform better on straight CO2 gas (over Argoshield) than most others. Now have a 3 Year warranty (Limited) which has to be worth something.
- Points:- Not that many really. Any Professional would consider them as 'Chat' but, for the money, they are pretty reliable.
OVERALL: 6/10

CEBORA (SNAP-ON)
+ Points:- The Cebora 'Pocket Turbo 130' was THE first small MIG on the market & has hardly changed since the original. Has a proper, heavy duty contactor unit fitted (as used on bigger industrial stuff) & generally very, very reliable with superb spares & technical support.
- Points:- Not the very best performance on extremely thin stuff & don't like working on CO2 (most makes don't). Expensive to buy & spare parts expensive (but you won't need em that often!).
OVERALL: 7/10

CLARKE
+ Points:- Overall best build quality with a reliable wire feed unit & the nicest quality torch in it's class.
- Points:- Hardly any really. The only gripe is dealing with a large national chain of 'counter sales' staff.
OVERALL: 8/10

Again, I stress that these are my own opinions (based on 15+ years working experience with the machines!) & should not be interpretated as a gospel 'league table'.
For you American viewers the Lincoln SP170, Millermatic 175 & Hobart Handler 180 ALL have 11/10 in comparison with the above.
weldequip



Bob

I started with a Clarke pro 90 for bodywork etc after starting this last project and borrowing a cemont 140a I got the taste for larger powered machines. I waited for the last vat free day and purchased the Clarke 205te and can only say how impressed I am with it. Only double the price of the original welder wish I'd gone larger long ago. I'd say buy the most powerful you can afford I really should have spent that bit extra for the 230 tec but I needed a new mask as well.

guys thanks for the input im still open to any other advice people have as got till next weekend for the vat free day to make my mind up

Ive a sealey mightmig 150, using straight Co2.

I couldnt weld when i started but im nearly finished tacking my chassis now.

I find it pretty easy to use.

I use a clarke 151 en turbo, it works fine provided you remember it is designed for hobby work and not 40 hours a week working, so treat it as such and it wont let you down. You can easily set it up for larger gas bottles quite cheaply through ebay for regultor etc.

Arfon

As touched on the best thing to do once you have purchased a welder is convert it to run off pub co2 bottles I pay the same for a large pub bottle as you would for the small canisters and it lasts a gazillion times longer still trying to find a way to get argoshield into it ! But the co2 gives a great weld factor in about £30 for a bottle and regulator .

Having just invested in a new mig welder (sealey siegen 180, £327.99 delivered) all I can say is get the best you can afford. My old machine (Cem 160) took 5kg reels and the feed motor was puny, it did a fair job but would frequently stutter and splutter because of inconsistent wire speed. The Siegen can take full size 15 kg reels and so has a much more robust feed motor. In comparison to the Cem it is just so much easier to produce consistently good welds. If you can afford it go for a machine that takes full size wire reels.

D.

Cheers guys im looking to prob spend around £200-£250 as it is vat free aswell so i can look a little above my price range but like i say it is not required for a full chassis as i will be getting that pre built.:)

all hoby rated migs have a fairly low rated duty cycle so upping the amp size is a good idea.
a bigger second hand semi pro unit will be a better buy.
anything to take a real gas bottle is a good idea and use mixed gas (5% co2)

Hi Poshguy,

I'm not to familiar with these machines but my general advice would be to choose a mig that takes 15kg rolls, has a good smooth motor feed, at least 150amps as this will stop it overheating and fitted with a Eurotorch and 4m lead (will find a 3m lead is too short reaching round chassis, plus eurotorch is much more robust and can be cheaply replaced if damaged - £40 for lead and torch).

Happy hunting....>AndyH

Spud thanks for advice im taking everyones advice and trying to find the best 1 in the range for the money so will prob post again for peoples thoughts when i find 1 lol

Spud struggling following your advice as all the clarke machine im looking at only say they take 5kg wire reels and they all just say professional torch which dont mean nothing to me lol,if any1 has opinions they will be appreciated

i used to sell welders and do techinical support unless you are doing alot of welding 5kg is fine i have made a whole chassis inc all the bits to go with it on 1 spool of 5kg
your not going to find a hobby rated unit that will feed a 15kg spool well
and it will be rusty before you finish it

keep a look out on local gumtree and ebay etc and somthing usualy pops up if you wait its well worth it

i found a real old sip 195 for £30 cleaned it up and treated it to a new euro torch and cables all for £35
yes its nothing fancy but i have got good welds all for £65 :)
idealy i would have liked to find somthing a little better quality but at the price i was going to give it a go and flog it on for more than i paid for it if didnt make the grade (sadly it works quiet well and holds a full size bottle)

if you realy realy want new try looking at somthing swp 170c or Parweld XTM161C would be the cheapest thing i would recommend

Thats spot on, we have a small mig where our fitter works and because he hardly ever uses it the mig wire was always rusty. What he does now is take the wire out of the machine and wrap it in a bin bag when not in use.Problem solved.

Bob

I have ten of those small silicone bags sat in in the bottom of the machine that comes with the wire, reels last for 3-4 months and does'nt go rusty in my less than warm workshop.

well to be honest im not neccesarily after a new machine i was just going to take advantage of the machine mart vat free day and reagrds buying second hand i dont really know enough about welders to know whats good and not.

Does anyone have any opinions on the ones below and also what is the difference bewteen the blue and red machines

The 3 im looking at but when looking at the specs they all seem the same.

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/pr...ig160tm-welder

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/pr...rbo-mig-welder

http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/pr...rbo-mig-welder

all help appreciated thanks

Try adams gas for small handy sized bottles of 5% argoshield as it is way better than straight co2, it's cleaner too.

the 160tm looks like it will take a proper gas bottle thats a bonus
find the spec's and look at the duty cycle ratings the higher the better

all have very simmular specs by the looks of it and you will realy struggle with the low duty cycles when you get to weld your chassis fully, do your rear uprights etc
if it has a duty of 20% at 130A that means at this power setting it needs 8mins rest (on so fan can cool it) to 2 mins of welding and so on any more than this and it over heats the transformer and cuts out and you have to wait ages for it to cool down also transformer effeincy drops badly as it gets hot

150A=10%
130A=20%
75A=60%
55A=100%

units that have all copper windings is what you need to look for as the dutys will be higher (will be real heavy). hobby gas bottles give low flow and realy work out to be expensive unless your just doing the odd job here and there.

Baz thanks for the reply i have looked and all the 3 machines have amperage at 60% duty is 75.

i dont need to weld a full chassis but at the same time if im going to buy 1 i would like to buy one that il be of use in the future also for other car projects etc.

tbh you need to move up to the next range higher but the mony steps up to a point where there will be better units elsewhere for less money
thats why i pointed out thoes other units earlyer
has a euro torch and copper transformer and choke
both the same with a diffrent badge on the side basicly a copy of a old lincoln 180c
practical classisc gave it a good review not long ago
you may find a used one badged as butters 170c (butters now gone)

pm me your postcode and i can look at ebay so see if there is anything good s/h local if you like

For the VAT inclusive price of the 160TM you could get the Siegen 180 that I just bought (327.99 with free delivery via ebay). It takes full 15kg reels and has a man sized feed motor. I've run mine at full bore and it will happily go into "spray transfer" and produces superb welds very easily.

For anyone who doesn't understand what "spray transfer" is I will explain. The weld filler (wire) melts in the arc and is transferred to the pieces being joined. There are three transfer modes, "dip" , "globular" and "spray".

In dip mode which occurs at lower current settings the wire actually melts in the weld puddle, the wire is literally "dipped" into the molten weld.In dip mode you get the bacon sizzling sound.

In globular mode which occurs at mid range current settings the wire melts just before entering the puddle and forms into globules which transfer to the weld puddle.
In globular mode you get a hum with intermittent crackles.

In spray mode which occurs at higher current settings the wire melts into fine droplets which are sprayed into the weld pool. In full spray mode the familiar bacon frying sizzle is replaced with a simple humming sound.

The three different modes will occur at different current settings depending on wire thickness,feed rate and power setting. The best mig welder I've ever used was a Hobart synergic machine costing several thousand pounds, that beast could run 1.6mm wire in full spray mode at 500 amps with a 100% duty cycle, it was water cooled.

D.