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-   -   Roll bar / harness mount Question (http://www.haynes.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=2767)

londonsean69 20th September 2009 01:04 PM

Roll bar / harness mount Question
 
Bit of a petty one this, but thought I would ask.

In the book, the drawing showing the roll bar construction (pg53) has the harness brackets shown pointing backwards.

However, in the photos on Pg123, they are pointing forwards (also a slightly different design).

Does it matter which way they point?

Cheers

Sean

HandyAndy 20th September 2009 01:23 PM

my own opinion on this is down to personal preference tho i,m sure there might be rules to some degree,
i,m actually fitting the upper harness mounts into the cross brace, actually drilled into the brace & welded top & bottom, this i believe removes any radius/projection concerns.

andy

londonsean69 20th September 2009 02:19 PM

Andy, what sort of harnesses are you looking at using? Bolt in or clip in??

I like the idea of 6 point harnesses, and can only seem to find them in clip in, which could be a pain come SVA time, so I may have to just use 4 point till post SVA

Sean

HandyAndy 20th September 2009 05:36 PM

now you,ve got me worried :eek:

my harnesses are Willan,s four point which are bolt in for the lap belts but are clip in for the upper mounts, :eek: are you saying that the clip in type are not going to pass IVA ? i,ve not heard that this would cause a fail ???

the upper mounts clip onto the bolts that have a ring on the top which would be welded into my roll bar cross brace.

cheers
andy

londonsean69 20th September 2009 06:04 PM

Don't panic - I'm just not sure how the tester would look upon eye bolts poking out, but then again, the radius is certainly legit.

It just seems it is easier to get covers for the normal type, that bolt on.

As for welding the rings into the roll bar, I still intend to use the 7/16 threaded bar from the book, then screw the eye bolt into that. Apparently it's a fail if they can't see the ends of the bolt ie. it must project through the entire bracket

I must also say that I have not actually looked at a harness properly yet. I didn't realise that they only clipped in at the top, although it would make sense (I assume the clips are so someone can be extracted) because screwing eye bolts in between seats etc. would be a PITA

Sean

AshG 20th September 2009 06:12 PM

i did mine like this as it removes a radius that has to be covered






HandyAndy 20th September 2009 06:19 PM

Ash, great pics, what you have done is what i intend doing but maybe didn,t describe it very well :o

would then bolt the "eye" into the bosses that are weled into the cross brace.

a pic tells a thousand words , cheers Ash:cool:

andy

londonsean69 20th September 2009 07:05 PM

So am I right in thinking then, that the brackets as shown in the book would fail IVA/SVA because they are classed as a projection?

Isn't there some rule about things behind you?

Sean

AshG 20th September 2009 08:23 PM

they are fine as book spec but you will have to put edge trim on them to pass the radius test. doing it as shown in the pictures above just means 4 less bits to cover up. it also looks better.

londonsean69 20th September 2009 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AshG (Post 21944)
they are fine as book spec but you will have to put edge trim on them to pass the radius test. doing it as shown in the pictures above just means 4 less bits to cover up. it also looks better.

Fair points, although I have already made my harness mounts, I may remake them the way you have them shown. It certainly looks neater

Sean

adrianreeve 21st September 2009 11:06 AM

I've also done mine the same way as Ash - great minds and all that!!!

Cheers

Adrian

jps 25th January 2021 10:08 AM

Once again this forum proves a great resource - i'm just working out where i'll fit the threaded bosses in my rollbar cross bar, pictures/info like this is really helpful.

bentovey 25th January 2021 08:47 PM

What are peopleís thoughts on wrapping the harness around the roll bar cross brace?

jps 26th January 2021 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bentovey (Post 106655)
What are peopleís thoughts on wrapping the harness around the roll bar cross brace?

I've been reading up, so have seen this mentioned. The comments I saw were:
1- You could have the harness run over a round tube and go down to a lower anchorage point. This would make the point where it ran over the round tube the 'effective mounting point' for IVA purposes, so would have to be at the minimum height/sufficient strong (same applies if the belts make contact with the seat when done up).

2 - Top harnesses that were just wrapped (not bolted) onto the cross bar, with no other fixing, might be problematic because they could easily slide side-to-side (either when loose, or in a crash). Couldn't find reference of anyone actually taking this setup to IVA...

bentovey 26th January 2021 07:00 PM

Itís option 2 I was going for. With the shoulder straps wrapped directly to the cross bar. Quite tight wrapping can be achieved with little to no sideways movement. I might put a rubber sleeve over the buckle for iva

jps 27th January 2021 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bentovey (Post 106657)
Itís option 2 I was going for. With the shoulder straps wrapped directly to the cross bar. Quite tight wrapping can be achieved with little to no sideways movement. I might put a rubber sleeve over the buckle for iva

Have you looked at the IVA manual? I had a quick scan and it doesn't make reference to wrapping in the section on Seatbelt Anchorages, but there are plenty of references to bolted fittings (and the required standards for them). Unless you can find an example of someone who has been through IVA with wrapped belts I'd assume you're going to run into problems with it.

You could always use option 1 for IVA and then change how the belts were fitted if you really wanted to (without having to make any structural changes....

voucht 28th January 2021 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jps (Post 106654)
Once again this forum proves a great resource - i'm just working out where i'll fit the threaded bosses in my rollbar cross bar, pictures/info like this is really helpful.

Hi,

That is how I've done it.

2014-08-23_15-51-08 by Voucht sans_nom, sur Flickr

2014-08-23_15-51-28 by Voucht sans_nom, sur Flickr

2014-08-23_15-52-17 by Voucht sans_nom, sur Flickr

There was a general consensus that putting the threaded bosses through the cross bar was a very good solution, and there is no need to use the 3mm steel bracket to fit them on the cross bas as explained in the book. I think a lot of builders did the same as me.

After, concerning my car, I kept the exact transversal position of the threaded bosses as explained page 53 of the book (254mm=300mm=254mm). They don't fall directly behind the harness holes of my seat, as I did my roll bar before buying the seats, and I guess every seat model has its own spacing of harness holes. But it is latterly acceptable, as, IIRC, there is a lateral angle tolerance in the regulation (needs to be checked on your IVA manual)

Then I bought Sabel harnesses. Harnesses need to be the short strap style or single seater type, as the saloon car type have way too long shoulder straps.

Hope that will help :)

jps 4th February 2021 09:18 AM

I had hoped to add some pictures of my own setup sooner, unfortunately - my seats are a very tight fit and, having painted my seat subframe, i'm still trying to get them fully aligned again - they really do clear with only a couple of mm, so it's a bit of a painful process getting them in!

I'll get it cracked this weekend, then put up some pics!


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