Bike Engine Position

[chriseyj]

Hi, I have bought a zx9r engine and dropped it in my chassis on blocks to see how it fits, but I could use some advice on it's position.

I don't think I can get the output sprocket in line with the centre of the tunnel/diff but I have noticed on several bike installs people sometimes have to angle the engine. Will it be ok offset or angled? am worried about prop vibration.

Also where the cam chain runs the sump hangs down a bit how how much can I leave sticking out below the chassis rails? I Understand I need to get the sump level.

Also should I shuffle it up close to the bulkhead or is it easy to leave space to get at alternator cover e.t.c.

P.S picked engine up last sunday it was nearly a 3 hour drive!, could not lift it out though and it has lived in the boot of my Celica for a week. Made a block and tackle in the end to lift it out over the wifes swinging bench frame. I don't think she's noticed the m10 holes I drilled in it.

Cheers Chris

[flyerncle]

Chris, you may need to baffle the sump to stop oil surge before you install it.
In the car it fit's east/west not north/south if you get my meaning.
Make sure the float chambers are level as well when its fitted or they will flood.

[chriseyj]

Thanks for the reply.
I read zx9r's need baffling but I was going to buy it at a later date when I can afford it and get the cradle built for the time being. I presume if the engine is level as it was designed to be i.e sump at right level then the carbs should be at the right angle also. The oil level window has a useful level guide on it.

I'm still unsure about the output shaft angle and offset and how this will effect the propshaft phasing I might ask on locost builders or search for posts as there are a lot of BEC's on there. Perhaps the center bearing or reversing box neccessary on a BEC helps cut down the vibration.

Can any one estimate the height of the nosecone so that I can get an idea of my bonnet clearance as I cant afford either a nose cone or a scuttle yet. I am sure scuttle height is in the book.

Cheers

[HandyAndy]

i haven,t got my car with me but seem to remember that the nose is 17cm above the top rails of the chassis in the center point & the scuttle is i think 21cm above TR9 on the cockpit side, i can get confirmed measurements tomorrow if you wish?

maybe use the above info & place some steel to those heights & place a string line between the 2 to give idea of the bonnet height, but don,t forget that the bonnet has a small bulge in it so giving slightly more engine clearance .

hope that helps.

andy

[chriseyj]

Thanks Andy your as helpful as ever. I was thinking of make a couple of simple mdf templates and mount them at the scuttle and nosecone and place some box section across as you say.
Have you any idea what is a reasonable amount of sump to have hanging down below chassis rails.
Cheers Chris

[ozzy1]

I built a formula 27 with a zx9 engine and this is what i can remember.
You will need to baffle the sump to stop oil surge,this is done with just flat plate of ali with cutouts for pickup etc. I think there is a company on ebay that do these.Also you can machine off the large piece of sump that angles down and has the drain plug in,move this to the side.
The alignment of the sprocket mount to the diff should be easy to get pretty spot on as the engine bay will easily have enough room for this,also the centre bearing mount will help with the vibration.The engine was also solid mounted.
With regard to the wiring you will also need to find and join the wires together for the sidestand cutout if you use the original loom.In respect of the oil window fill it to the max,probably obvious but better safe than sorry.
Not sure if this small pic helps with engine pos/angle?

[HandyAndy]

i,m not sure of sump depths of a bike engine in the chassis as i,m using the cvh engine but my sump( shortened sump) is level with the bottome edge of the lower chassis rails, although my gearbox bellhousing is 25mm below the bottome chassis rail,
from my experience of bikes ( ex racer...) the engines are very compact so i don,t think you,ll have any sump below the chassis & still have clearance under the bonnet, i,m pretty sure your zx9 engine won,t be any taller than my cvh engine.
that nose measurement i gave was taken from the engine compartment point of the nose cone NOT the front of the nose/car.

i try my best to help when i can

cheers
andy

[chriseyj]

Thanks Ozzy I read one of your previous posts about using a zx9r. Thanks for the pic and advice I will try and get the output sprocket dead center if you reckon there's room.
Have seen the baffles for £39 somewhere will buy one at some point.

Not sure I have the ability to machine down sump do you mean just the patr protecting the drain plug not chopping that hole area and welding?

Thanks Andy I presumed you meant engine compartment part of nose cone, does this start at the front top rail?
Cheers.

[ozzy1]

yeah just the part at the drain plug as this hangs about 60mm lower than the rest of the sump.Im sure someone near you will be able to help.From what i recall my sump was about 50mm below the bottom rail thats why the part by the sump plug is machined off.just be aware that the sump alloy is very cheap quality shit and needs to be very clean to get a good penetrating weld.Im sure i recall there are a couple of companies who machine a whole new reduced height billet sump to suit this engine but cost about 500 quid!!You will also need to reduce the oil pickup pipe length.Maybe worth emailing few companies like Mk,spire etc.
I had mine done by Formula 27 ,now owned by image sportscars i think.
Currently a guy doing them on ebay for 28quid,says email him for different models .item number is 110450647037
On a different note i found the 3.62 ratio diff much more pleasant to drive than the 3.92 most people recommend.

[chriseyj]

Thanks again for the advice I'll work on having that long part of the sump 50mm below and get it modified when the time comes.

I notice from you picture Ozzy that therocker cover is almost inline with the side rail (unless it's an illusion). Does this mean the engine was slightly angled from front to back and the crank/engine isn't parallel with the chasis front to back.
Hope I make sense.