Radiator

[DaveyB]

If I fit the merc 190 radiator to cool my 2.0 litre pinto, will I still need to fit a electric cooling fan ?

any help greatly appreciated

DaveyB

[voucht]

Hi Davey,
I would say yes with no hesitation. You will get a much better control of the cooling temperature in any conditions.
And you can get rid of the ugly original plastic fan from the Pinto, which is a must :D

I have a Mercedes 190 radiator, and I fitted a 12'' fan. There was an electric fan control on my engine (2.0i DOHC), so I reused the wiring and it works perfectly.

For your Pinto, you will have to add an auto fan switch.

Some pictures of mine:

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5476/9445547729_e327b9a0ae.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/99498333@N06/9445547729/)
2013-06-07_14-34-09 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/99498333@N06/9445547729/) par Voucht71 (http://www.flickr.com/people/99498333@N06/), sur Flickr

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5449/9448297044_a182042ea5.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/99498333@N06/9448297044/)
2013-07-08_12-02-25 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/99498333@N06/9448297044/) par Voucht71 (http://www.flickr.com/people/99498333@N06/), sur Flickr

Good luck :)

[Hoybi]

Hello DaveyB,

Have a look at this short movie. (I did remove the radiator protection)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/buakf2payciiu04/VID_20130730_191916.mp4

Last week the engine ran first time after installation. After a few minutes, temperature and pressure was so high that the pressure vessel burst open, squirting a couple of liters boiling water at me. Smile off my face and severe wounds to both hands and my chest. Could have been worse though.

What we think that happened is this: When the engine turns, the fan is spinning but at a certain point the thermostat/clutch of the fan should have engaged but didn't. So temperature and pressure got far too high, resulting in the bursting.

Note that the mercedes 190, 2 liter radiator is mounted directly in front of the fan, as in the Sierra.

Eddy

[jps]

If I fit the merc 190 radiator to cool my 2.0 litre pinto, will I still need to fit a electric cooling fan ?

any help greatly appreciated

DaveyB

Is that with the Pinto fan still in place - or are you wondering if you can run with no fan at all?

I don't think 'no fan at all' is really an option - unless you are going to use the car for track only and stick some sort of cooling system in place outside the car after a run - e.g. attach a fan to the front of the car in the pits (like they do with F1 cars for example)...

[DaveyB]

Wasn't really sure about the fan thought maybe leave existing and see how it performed, thanks for the help will now look at an after market electric which will be more efficient.

I think if i remember Ash G had a problem with pipework coming a drift and having some nasty burns certainly be quite a moment when first starting i'm a long way off that

Thanks for the help
Daveyb

[baz-r]

a raidiator is just a heat exchanger and needs air flow to transfer heat to the air to work
you will need a fan to move air when your staitionery

my merc rad is working very well with a fan and only cuts in in jams and coolent tems drop back truning fan off as soon as im moving 20mph and up

[DaveyB]

Thanks will make sure I add a fan

DaveyB

[flyerncle]

Thermo switch in the pipe to control remote elec fan is probably the easiest.

[loony]

I have MB190 radiator and like Voucht I bought 12" universal fan...

But... be carefull - my fan don't fit my radiator. Or my "replacement" radiator has different inner sizes or my 12" fan is bigger than Voucht's.

As my fan is 297mm I think that Voucht fan is as they call it 11"... or genuine MB radiator is little bigger. So guys - look out.

Now my turn for questions...
I need to grind a little of fan housing, but it's not big deal...

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-9xLgczN0SEs/Upsgf42Ay1I/AAAAAAAACtM/Qx3vQN482K4/w542-h722-no/DSC_0177.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-es-xQKZ9Y3s/UpshhMlsuVI/AAAAAAAACtc/XVDZPQLUnC4/w963-h722-no/mocowania.jpg

Question is... how to fit fan. Should I use "yellow" mounting points or "red" ? Or maybe both ? Or turn fan 90 degrees and use 4 mounting points like "red" ? I don't like the idea of mounting to the core of radiator (it's chineese)
"Yellow" mounting points fits nicely to sides of radiator (can't see this on photo) I need to know before housing grinding...
Are the two mounting points enough ?

[SeriesLandy]

Have you tried the fan on a power supply yet. I was surprised how powerful mine is and it tried to spin around on its own.

I would have said 4 fixings is needed. I used the push through core fixings which seem fine on my polo rad. Can you not drill a new hole further in on the yellow fixings and attach to the core?

[ayjay]

It will probably flap against your fins at high speed:eek:

[loony]

I can attach mounting points (they are detachable) like below and mount to radiator core....
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-P9CRNC324s8/UptHnoZ0buI/AAAAAAAACuA/z9kwA5dYy34/w963-h722-no/DSC_0183.jpg

Can't see this on photo but they fit...

[voucht]

Lucas,
Your fan should be a 12'' blade, mine is a 12'' overall (305mm diam). But I think yours if fine for the side of the radiator you want to fit it on.
I fitted mine on the other side because I had to turned the radiator around to have the lower water inlet on the left side, and the high one on the right side : it is much better for my engine set up. But that way, I needed to fit the fan on the radiator's side where the core's side plates are offset and not flush. So I had to chose smaller diameter to fit the fan in between those two offset side plates.
If you fit your fan on the side where the side plates and brackets are flush with the core, the diameter you chose is good : it covers a bigger surface than mine.

To fit your fan, remember one very important thing : the fan has to be flush with the core face, it has to be perfectly against the core, to touch it. Otherwise most of the airflow it will suck will not come from trough the radiator, but from the sides.
Also, as already mention on this forum, a puller fan is more efficient than a blower fan and should always be preferred. Blower fan should be installed only if there not enough room to fit a puller between the radiator and the engine.

I didn't want to fit mine trough the core with the lock ties either, but it looks to be a very popular way of fitting fans, used a lot on racing cars. I had no other choice, so I did it this way, and finally, I'm fine with it. Just be very careful when you enlarge the holes in the fins not to damage the tubes.

Good luck :)

[loony]

OK - fan housing modified... it's touching radiator core when in place just like you said Voucht. It will be "puller", but I need to decide how radiator would be mounted (according to engine needs)

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-2hew0LsgwCs/UptkZx-_6NI/AAAAAAAACwc/8Rn5b9d52WQ/w963-h722-no/DSC_0184.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-SS4HBpTNIdU/UptkP9TZQLI/AAAAAAAACwU/0KA0Yi7q6JY/w963-h722-no/DSC_0185.jpg

I'll fix it trough the core with 4 mounting points. If it's ok for racing use it'll be good for my roadster ;)

[voucht]

Looks very nice Lucas!
Here are the fitting instructions from Davies Craig (the brand of the fan I have).

http://www.daviescraig.com.au/Images/DCSL%20SERIES%20FAN%20INSTRUCTIONS%20%2808-08-06%29.pdf

On page 2 are the recommendations for fitting through the core and I found them very useful when I fitted mine.

Perhaps you will too :)

[K4KEV]

I mounted through the core too with zip ties but I felt unhappy about it actually touching the core, as after all aluminium is a really soft metal so I played safe and put double sided foam tape around the rim where it would touch just a thought mind you.:D

[voucht]

Yep Kev, you're right. Actually some fan manufacturers (like PACET, unfortunately they no longer exist which is a shame as they were making the best performing fans) supply their fans with the double sided foam tape, pre-cut to the fan's shape.

[baz-r]

I have a front mounted pushing fan with no issues at all even on the dyno or thrashing on a hot day.

the way I see it you get a restriction of airflow with it infront or behind the rad

some fans have directional blade patterns and push more air in one direction than the other even if the motor is bidirectional

[raceral]

It is best to not go through the fins for an attachment.
I made mine with a few simple straps that secures it to the radiator itself.
Quite easy and has worked out well.

Al

[voucht]

the way I see it you get a restriction of airflow with it infront or behind the rad


Hi Baz,
David wrote a long post about that on this thread, so did I :) Most of the answer I would have published here is over there.
http://www.haynes.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=6165&page=10



some fans have directional blade patterns and push more air in one direction than the other even if the motor is bidirectional

And a complement in answer to what you say : Blower fans with special designed bladed which make them more efficient than the puller equivalent, have just been designed to increase the efficiency of a blower fan because some applications do not have enough room between the engine and the radiator to install a puller. So it is totally normal that these kind of design exists, but it doesn't make a blower set-up more efficient or generally preferable to a puller set-up, for the reason exposed here and the other thread.