Loony's BEC Roadster Build Thread

[loony]

Maybe it's to early, but to keep forum clean I decided to create my build thread.

Beginings where similar to everyones here.
First I bought the book "Build your own sports car: for as little as 250GBP" on ebay.co.uk. Book costs 0,99GBP and 5GBP p&p :) It was about 2 years ago...
I realized that it will be very difficult to find parts mentioned in the book here in Poland. So... I need something for more popular Ford Sierra.
Next - in August 2010 - I bought "proper" book... and so it begins.
I choose BEC because I want something different than my last project (powerfull but heavy - turboed '93 BMW 325i). Must be lightweight and... with better economy - cheap insurance, good MPG. So "under 1000cc" BEC will be what I'm looking for.
In October I bought Sierra rear end - propshaft, 3.62 LSD diff, driveshafts, calipers, rear hubs and front uprights. Then - to keep proper brake bias - I bought Mondeo Mk2 V6 front calipers (same as Scorpio/Granada Cosworth) to use with 278mm brake disks.

I cleaned rear calipers and painted with black Hammerite:
http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1883/img9854iu.jpg
Now it's time for front calipers, uprights and rear hubs.

Yesterday I got my laser cut chassis plates (with modified front wishbones plates for use with Kadett/Lanos ball joint - Maxi is unavailable in Poland):
http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/9881/img9849l.jpg



Next - I need Mig/Mag welder :)

[james3004]

Did you strip the calipers to paint them, cos I'm stuggling to work out how to pull them apart

[flyerncle]

If they work ok leave them alone and paint,they are a work of art to strip and repair.

[james3004]

I want to powdercoat them, and the need de-rusting :(

[ozzy1]

I wouldnt bother stripping them just send them to these guys :D

http://biggred.co.uk/index.php

[loony]

Yes - I was stripping them to repair handbrake and then de-rust and paint. It was quite difficult, but now they work nice and smooth.
Look at photos in this topic - it's in Polish, but photos are multilingual ;) http://www.audi80.pl/90-b3-ng-regeneracja-zacisku-lewy-tyl-vt44458.htm

[loony]

It was quite a long time I wrote, but I have to change my as you call it "daily driver" (Ford Escort 1.8TD with camshaft belt broken), so... roadster have to wait... (cruel world).
I bought a "new daily driver" - Opel/Vauxhall Frontera 2.2DTI 2002 (Polish roads are terrible) and... now I have some debts to pay (I already paid a part borrowed from my brother, but there's a second part borrowed from my parents).

But... I didn't give up. I bought MIG welder :) - 0% installment purchase ;)
It's a Bester 1700s (by Lincoln Electric) - 160A max - so it should be good enough to weld Roadster ;)
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/3270/magpower1700s.jpg

Now - I'll practice welding by creating dog guard and roof rack...

[loony]

Last news - I'VE GOT ENGINE ! (Sorry - I'm little excited)

http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/5558/dsc00285w.jpg

Yesterday evening I was on the "trip". I bought 2003 ZX9R engine "package" for about £436.
Package contains everything I need (or I think so): engine, carbs, complete wiring loom (CDI, relays, fuses, etc.), airbox, exhaust manifold, radiator with fan, fuel pump... and damaged clocks ;)
I'm really happy. I'll post better photos when I find someone to help me take engine out of my trunk ;)

Now, I can start real building of a car :) Time to weld chassis...

[loony]

Last progress...
I have my laser cut reverse gear... I hope it'll fit in transmission tunnel (156mm diameter)
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/7636/lasercutreversegearside.jpg
http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/7636/lasercutreversegearside.jpg
http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/4839/lasercutreversegearteet.jpg

Mushrooms made of steel (but cost me about 12GBP):
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/3993/mushroomssmall.jpg

[loony]

And parts of sprocket adapter (laser cut 20mm steel donut and turned ZX9R sprocket):
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/7934/sprocketdonut.jpg

[loony]

Little update...
In October I made build table...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kattHmrC0ys/UPW0EkdGd0I/AAAAAAAABQ8/OP8YVCufI-Q/s935/DSC00556.jpg

My little helper...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-1421ThfbbAE/UPW0FGlSn-I/AAAAAAAABRA/1QFwjy4NCJ4/s935/DSC00559.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-jRX7iSel00k/UPW0KSERThI/AAAAAAAABRs/tWoXhOLAIK0/s935/DSC00566.jpg

Then I brought steel
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-40p0FW6ERqA/UPW0HmKrTDI/AAAAAAAABRY/pGou_Aej7CI/s935/DSC00563.jpg

[loony]

And the battle with chassis began...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-mKollvKjhqM/UPW0McsJ9LI/AAAAAAAABSA/RxNbB6api6o/s935/DSC00567.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-3UeS-SaFoYU/UPW0NE3xVMI/AAAAAAAABSE/E6LKEfCQQ28/s935/DSC00568.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-GtOiZez6lao/UPW0OqSQ5xI/AAAAAAAABSY/F5rjxE8giuE/s935/DSC00592.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-CDLuINZ6dGg/UPW0P3wUYlI/AAAAAAAABSg/80QiuROz4wU/s935/DSC00593.jpg

[loony]

Front frame
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-eSbSUlsnX90/UPW0P6BuOLI/AAAAAAAABSk/GHgTdXLziqY/s935/DSC00602.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-WH3pOLYTJRg/UPW0Qgml4oI/AAAAAAAABSs/cDwKjkxPh6g/s935/DSC00603.jpg

I'm not happy with the result - I think I will have to make one again... but I'll see how it fit to the rest of chassis.

But it's cold outside, I'm sick (some kind of flu) so I orginised my work different ;)

[loony]

One guy from work has lathe, I draw some sketches and he did for me some parts:

Crush tubes, bush tubes... with DIY polyurethan bushes (I made them myself from two-component polyurethan resin)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-WENpX9a6g6c/UPW0aPeP9dI/AAAAAAAABT0/2oHf8cWmO-0/s935/DSC00648.jpg
It's just an example - I got whole set of them...

Front camber adjusters, sleeve tubes and rear camber tubes (?):
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-EuQqcfp0G24/UPW0V_KBx0I/AAAAAAAABTQ/BXoEgjjnN5o/s935/DSC00644.jpg

DIY sprocket adapter almost ready (SAE1140 flange)...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-xe3_c0HaFsw/UPW0X4jVt8I/AAAAAAAABTg/IZx2J-9YLHg/s935/DSC00645.jpg

Need some welding...
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/--j4zxlZ3Cvc/UPW0VdiSEsI/AAAAAAAABTM/J3sUkNYwrQU/s935/DSC00643.jpg
... and then turning/balancing...

Tomorrow I plan to weld it but balancing/turning have to wait until water cooled lathe defrost and start to work again...
Next week I will have catalytic gas heater - maybe this would help keep me warm while building.

[ayjay]

Looks like you have all the skills to make an excellent roadster:)

Looks good so far ,keep it up. The winter usually sorts the men builders from the boys:rolleyes:
You may need a nuclear power plant in your garage for Polish winters:D

[voucht]

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-jRX7iSel00k/UPW0KSERThI/AAAAAAAABRs/tWoXhOLAIK0/s935/DSC00566.jpg



Hoho, I think I recognize this layout :)
Good and rewarding to see that other people use it, and that this layout has not only been used once on my table. Still available from my Google documents (https://docs.google.com/folder/d/0B-iOekLVikV5NWQ3MTVjNTctNTEzMy00MjRhLWFmODMtNGVjNzA2 ZDg5YWIz/edit)

And it is still immaculate, it will not last :D

And by the way, you look to be doing a very good job, so congratulations. Polish winter should be at least as harsh as the Swedish one, and I have to confess I don't spend that much time in the workshop, so double congrats :)

[wylliezx9r]

I've got a full stainless steel exhaust system and manifold that would suit your car if you are interested ?

Cheers Dan

[loony]

I've got a full stainless steel exhaust system and manifold that would suit your car if you are interested ?


I thought you sold it with the engine...

It's all about the money ;) I don't know how much it could cost in Poland to make one (probably much cheaper then in UK) and what's good deal for me.

Beside, I'm not sure if it suit my car/engine position (as to the right as possible) but with little modification should be OK.

Is this photo flipped or... I don't know how this fit zx9r ;)
http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g400/danielburberry/IMAG0332.jpg
Do you have any photo of it on the car ? (I saw only your old manifold)

[loony]

TIG welded DIY sprocket adaptor - ready for action ;)

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/--GUvLy-Qn9I/UPgh2FOjK6I/AAAAAAAABUg/c-jOJpo1CYU/s935/DSC00650.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-RwcSGWJdC54/UPgh1hqfyRI/AAAAAAAABUY/qGvoOU9p9cA/s935/DSC00649.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-l_h7fXf3Odw/UPgh1miFkUI/AAAAAAAABUc/UC0MP1gZ0HI/s935/DSC00652.jpg

[loony]

Last purchase:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-KHiZcIaaXFk/UQLo1rpRN2I/AAAAAAAABVw/ue0RG_9vs4E/s935/DSC00657.jpg
10GBP - and only one problem - I got no key to ignition barrel... It would be my first barrel breaking in life :)

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-GIAHifEpEUM/UQLo1xNhXrI/AAAAAAAABV0/50obqf1dzPg/s935/DSC00659.jpg
Genuine MOMO hub (K4524) - I tried it on my column and looks like it fits...
Apart that I already have Raid steering wheel (different PCD)... but for 6,40GBP - I couldn't resist... I'll have excuse to buy snap-off adapter ;)

Next week I'll get another column - adjustable one and OEM Sierra steering wheel...

[robo]

Last purchase:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-KHiZcIaaXFk/UQLo1rpRN2I/AAAAAAAABVw/ue0RG_9vs4E/s935/DSC00657.jpg
10GBP - and only one problem - I got no key to ignition barrel... It would be my first barrel breaking in life

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-GIAHifEpEUM/UQLo1xNhXrI/AAAAAAAABV0/50obqf1dzPg/s935/DSC00659.jpg
Genuine MOMO hub (K4524) - I tried it on my column and looks like it fits...
Apart that I already have Raid steering wheel (different PCD)... but for 6,40GBP - I couldn't resist... I'll have excuse to buy snap-off adapter ;)

Next week I'll get another column - adjustable one and OEM Sierra steering wheel...

Nice ingredients going into that roadster soup:cool:

Bob

[twinturbo]

Take the column to your local auto locksmith and he should be able to read the barrel and make a new key.

TT

[loony]

Thanks for advice ;) Too late... It's already broken... took me about 1h.
Beside, it could be cheaper to buy new barrel than make a new key...

[loony]

Yesterday achievements:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-qo_up8IvR18/UQ1T4i7APSI/AAAAAAAABXo/jb3XKfxdkWA/s935/DSC00676.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-82pXlztqAt8/UQ1T7qQGTSI/AAAAAAAABYA/IxLbk4Duz8o/s935/DSC00680.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Rqo9k_3AKIU/UQ1T-a54aoI/AAAAAAAABYU/jAAEHQ49OHk/s935/DSC00683.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-7q3x5KYBq-k/UQ1T-zpWCDI/AAAAAAAABYc/1KVDV7fxpe0/s935/DSC00685.jpg

It's motivating when you see chassis start to look more and more like a car...

[loony]

On Friday I picked up my new master cylinder:

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Y79kBMF6EZ8/UQ1T5fHYjHI/AAAAAAAABX0/tb4af2vOQKY/s935/DSC00674.jpg

As you can see - it's for Fiat - Uno/Panda.
Delphi LM70023 -19,05mm bore, 3x m10x1 outputs. I hope it would be OK for my all-disc setup... (19,05mm bore is suggested by "locostbuiders" to replace standard Sierra 22,22mm master cylinder)
Input fittings are "extra" from my buddy as I plan to use external brake fluid reservoir.

It costed about £12... so one of the cheapest master cylinder on the market ;)

[Dualist]

It's motivating when you see chassis start to look more and more like a car...

Oh bloody hell yes :)

[loony]

Yesterday progress (couldn't make more pictures because of flat battery in smartphone).

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/--9aCgfzgyY4/URLOk_PfnjI/AAAAAAAABZI/Ubm6czZuSiA/s935/DSC00691.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-R8eO6MtpZcs/URLOlOIkEKI/AAAAAAAABZQ/GLayGwmY0yQ/s935/DSC00692.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-wZIQlRaqQQg/URLOlHR8tjI/AAAAAAAABZM/dsgEP2IBxC8/s935/DSC00694.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-jx5yvJhqNwM/URLOnL_X-gI/AAAAAAAABZg/1nRgEwK5nxE/s935/DSC00695.jpg

[loony]

Today:

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/--vxFr70RWrc/URLOoKQETZI/AAAAAAAABZs/YzoR7bk5Wmk/s935/DSC00696.jpg

My dog's favorite place:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-_G6Km7USDUY/URLOoMJ2KwI/AAAAAAAABZo/BS_0eRgdd20/s701/DSC00698.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-HEvfZ5CNvE4/URLOpKcH6NI/AAAAAAAABZ4/yLXM4qaJ8rg/s935/DSC00699.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-o2C16SIkec8/URLOq3_aM1I/AAAAAAAABaA/fc2E168FAiA/s935/DSC00700.jpg

[loony]

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-UmjWVtKuKso/URLOrIS2fMI/AAAAAAAABaE/rTQe-Qh0cHQ/s935/DSC00701.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-r4_Y7QdpOfk/URLOrbj0F-I/AAAAAAAABaM/XFs_7Wp03no/s935/DSC00702.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-0Y-I3OePJwc/URLOtT9-P5I/AAAAAAAABac/MVcxDSM8d2U/s935/DSC00704.jpg

Next update: Saturday (I hope) ;)

[loony]

Saturday update...

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-5IigsmwXTNw/URdPMB3JS4I/AAAAAAAABbA/Tbe7juYU-C8/s935/DSC00705.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-Va5caZwZC1c/URdPMG9J94I/AAAAAAAABbE/N7FvNkaMFBc/s935/DSC00706.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-1Ktu_7ZOvtw/URdPMHMx1UI/AAAAAAAABbI/Ibo_P3ECIvg/s935/DSC00707.jpg
Yes - it's straight (I plan to hide reverse motor and handbrake lever in it)

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-PrxWksComWg/URdPOnjXUDI/AAAAAAAABbY/8mNJYTlNYA8/s935/DSC00708.jpg

[loony]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-1nck8Blq0YI/URdPPDZX9JI/AAAAAAAABbg/RiTl1SSw30s/s935/DSC00709.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-X9F55hgLYAA/URdPPY2qAnI/AAAAAAAABbk/T8p1apEawpI/s935/DSC00710.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-du34Sr2_Pu4/URdPRHInXsI/AAAAAAAABbw/bZf5CbJ8K1I/s935/DSC00711.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-pDYH2P9HqDI/URdPR6WaqGI/AAAAAAAABb4/kcs6IbNmA_U/s935/DSC00712.jpg

And now... should I fully weld it, or make rear suspension framework...
Chassis is bolted/welded to build table, so in my opinion it would be better to fully weld it now, then make rear framework, and in the end - weld suspension brackets...

[loony]

I also made bucket's insert - for electrolysis cleaning (front calipers, maybe upright/hubs):
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-msZSu83Yobo/URdPT2J2kSI/AAAAAAAABcM/VjYz-kJWxe0/s935/DSC00725.jpg

[loony]

Another Saturday...

First, I got my Birthday present - mainly form myself, but my "other half" had her contribution in it. Now I'm ready to take care after all this nuts ;-)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-gmlHM6r2SDg/UR_g0XI8QJI/AAAAAAAABdE/vi1PaCH5MNU/s935/DSC00728.jpg

I also picked up Fiat Cinquecento seats - bought some time age for... about £10. Naturally seats are too wide, but... I need only runners, which are very easy to modify (only one bar/tube). Universal runners alone cost more than this whole seats...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-VxBvI7-pK-M/UR_g0BRaZsI/AAAAAAAABc8/T-jYDqMByJk/s935/DSC00726.jpg

So, first task was to separate runners form seats...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-e8EpWmP_39M/UR_g2Xhpa_I/AAAAAAAABdQ/higw0KdIGZs/s935/DSC00731.jpg

Few minutes later...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-_icfO6PGk-c/UR_g3HpwkPI/AAAAAAAABdY/rRi06dRHs-U/s935/DSC00732.jpg

[loony]

On Thursday I picked upa GRP seats for "client". As my seats will be same but 50mm wider (these are 39cm wide so they are tight), I can plan where I need my runners.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-qkO7cKL8Jy4/UR_gziNEijI/AAAAAAAABc4/V98OBXJspoA/s935/DSC00729.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-bt7OGpnwRpQ/UR_g3Jm38dI/AAAAAAAABdc/2FdqdsEHrH0/s935/DSC00733.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-U3fYTrMKSAs/UR_g4Yrsj6I/AAAAAAAABdo/mjGqB44y-6w/s935/DSC00734.jpg

I also made steering support frame...
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/--Mbq4JBFPsI/UR_g6a7OZMI/AAAAAAAABdw/xhYhxT3drxs/s935/DSC00735.jpg

[loony]

Finally I couldn't resist to trial fit some components:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-i1MxecrnoOc/UR_g6oL-zLI/AAAAAAAABd0/93dsPCjcq3U/s935/DSC00738.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-vLArf99FTr8/UR_g7KclSaI/AAAAAAAABeA/Fez_YyA71lg/s935/DSC00739.jpg

Because I didn't want to start something bigger - I prepared tubes and welded pedals...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-3M3cGYAhF-U/UR_g8IKhk_I/AAAAAAAABeI/D_TQGqAxNiA/s701/DSC00741.jpg

Next I will fully weld chassis, before I move it forward to weld rear suspension frame...

[loony]

Today I got my MKIndy inspired laser cut rear uprights:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-GhenZtZ2eXA/USKfWKeRtfI/AAAAAAAABew/W_eVg7Hzuuc/s935/DSC00745.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-f7l9sq5NOio/USKfV_NHiFI/AAAAAAAABe4/UYprpRpJo8U/s935/DSC00746.jpg

And... my first SolidWorks finished project - seat mounting plate:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-SGN9WueA6BY/USMpwIMtdHI/AAAAAAAABfY/S88qvOOx4qg/s902/mocowanie.jpg

[Oscar]

Not sure if you've realised yet, but your chassis has a major design flaw...






Steering wheels on the wrong side :eek: :D

Looking great, especially like the rear upright design. Should be super strong!

[loony]

Not sure if you've realised yet, but your chassis has a major design flaw...
Steering wheels on the wrong side :eek: :D


Damn, I knew it's something wrong with this angles ;)
I have spare steering column so I can weld second on the other side ;)

[loony]

Another small step to happiness:

I drill/cut holes for master cylinder...
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/--48HwrvFG54/USVHTgATuqI/AAAAAAAABf8/stBzKpfJBhE/s935/DSC00747.jpg

And fit "custom" CP15 to steering column support:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/--YjJSr6sDaE/USVHT3lEEhI/AAAAAAAABgA/NaTLxcIpVv4/s935/DSC00748.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-qd3-5vZjBr4/USVHTwFJgEI/AAAAAAAABgE/Ngh09RGi7oQ/s935/DSC00749.jpg
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-akTw0bpyfZc/USVHVYoK4VI/AAAAAAAABgU/6VfQaIiHsF4/s935/DSC00750.jpg

Of course I have problem with clearance between steering column and TR9, so I will finish it when I get column bearing (maybe friday/saturday).

[loony]

After long battle, yesterday I picked up column bearing... PFL205 housing + UC205 bearing:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-KxiMVaTKPvU/US2npcLHCeI/AAAAAAAABk4/VfFtMf562HI/s902/DSC00804.jpg

[loony]

Update:
I changed steering wheel - 32cm Raid fits much better than OEM Sierra:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-_vEGIi4i5Ms/US_HdlD3vnI/AAAAAAAABlk/Dir0FGY_mag/s935/DSC00805.jpg

And column bearing on it's place:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-M3tqd0_-DUo/US_HdqwYvQI/AAAAAAAABlo/Sub0vBYeS70/s935/DSC00806.jpg

I found old/new pedals ovarlay kit:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-c4IPz_8WBBs/US_Hez58MUI/AAAAAAAABl0/M4jwmX2vcss/s935/DSC00808.jpg

But - will it fit to the Roadster ? They are 6cm (clutch&brake pedal) and 5,5cm (gas pedal) wide...

[loony]

Saturday update:
I bought VAG starter motor for my electric reverse - another £10
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Ig439H-mkxI/UTI456GUyXI/AAAAAAAABnM/PyH4JRPek3E/s935/DSC00814.jpg

It's a 0,9kW starter from 1,2/1,4 Polo/Fabia/Golf etc.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-An0lQfqJhTk/UTI45k8B93I/AAAAAAAABnI/39Kb-pMgEq0/s935/DSC00813.jpg

And I trial fit reverse gear to transmission tunnel - it's OK (as big as it can - 5mm clearance on both sides):
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/--H7u2BYqRnE/UTI42eLlCzI/AAAAAAAABmw/QhUUnlnkt5g/s899/DSC00809.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-uaFMHmEVWzw/UTI42iyOqwI/AAAAAAAABm0/gL8P-iz1-Qg/s899/DSC00810.jpg

[loony]

Yesterday I picked up rear frame tubes, so ... it's time to weld chassis and move it forward:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-x9oLTCWbipg/UTI47ICFCNI/AAAAAAAABnU/gpnVjkaN-r0/s899/DSC00815.jpg

And... now it's done - welded and moved forward to build rear frame:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-nxUh_F_ZvXw/UTI49jBCRCI/AAAAAAAABns/d98SZ3NDebU/s899/DSC00818.jpg
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-kEk2-LXU_0c/UTI4_biurgI/AAAAAAAABn0/Of2xFkxCZFA/s899/DSC00819.jpg

[wylliezx9r]

Good work Lucas, keep it up !

[maxubar]

Hi.
Where did you get that ring for the electric reverse? I'm currently searching for one or a drawing to have it cutted..

Thanks
Tiago

[loony]

Where did you get that ring for the electric reverse? I'm currently searching for one or a drawing to have it cutted..


I draw one myself - DP12 72 teeth, 156mm diameter. Then it was laser cutted, but it's better to use waterjet instead of laser (too complex shape = too much heat).
Link: DP12 Z72 156mm.dxf (https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B4J9g8-XOba3eXZ0UVZCdmhVWVE/edit?usp=sharing)

[loony]

Today progress:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-8WPunq5B644/UUTdGzC8qHI/AAAAAAAABoo/C-JXBfxAh3k/s935/DSC00832.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-7Wc-vOty8OU/UUTdHEn_8sI/AAAAAAAABow/tA-XsgQXkvE/s935/DSC00833.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-LRXo3Y5z6rs/UUTdJZVTvvI/AAAAAAAABo8/UYlhobn38wQ/s935/DSC00835.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-VOLEiTZlqeI/UUTdKC__sVI/AAAAAAAABpE/GNdBrxFNn48/s935/DSC00836.jpg

[loony]

And some chassis plates...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-AfvgybkAruE/UUTdKbZOzEI/AAAAAAAABpI/c6UucV2AaCY/s935/DSC00837.jpg

[loony]

Another block in the roadster puzzle... after over week of waiting (Polish post office is a nightmare) I got my steering rack... for about £14 :)

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-ZET0Z8F9aFk/UUy49HGX9SI/AAAAAAAABpw/gItVQeb7tJ4/s935/DSC00842.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-5lyep_mH_Qw/UUy49SrhXGI/AAAAAAAABp4/nklkgpq0jeA/s935/DSC00844.jpg

It's RHD Fiat Punto Mk2 PAS steering rack... TRW 37502372.
So as some of you realised it's FWD steering rack, so it wouldn't work. But, as I live in Poland and I building LHD car... and I will mount it upside down, everything will be OK (I hope).

Why this rack ? It's locost ? Yes, but... there's something else. Rack length (tie rod swivel center to swivel center) is about 530-540mm - better than Escort Mk2 rack, which is almost unavailable in Poland (almost, because you can always order it from UK, but it's not cheap). Maybe it's not "quick-rack" - about 2,7 lock-to-lock, but still better tha eg. Smart steering rack ;)

[loony]

Busy day...

First - trial fit of steering rack:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-m1g5A7XgSeE/UU44xhLkkQI/AAAAAAAABrY/SpPdyDUDEUY/s935/DSC00853.jpg
I need different than book mounting plates (vertical), but it should be OK.

And back to welding:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-O7ld-yznwtM/UU44zgHXB7I/AAAAAAAABrg/8UKks2wLb9U/s935/DSC00854.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-cDgrn48qZ3s/UU440-_dVCI/AAAAAAAABrw/VbMo8yec7Gc/s935/DSC00856.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-eSfYFoOtPXM/UU442BKj0lI/AAAAAAAABr4/xuydjs7XoJs/s935/DSC00857.jpg

[loony]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-fXiMnOG33QY/UU444QljURI/AAAAAAAABsM/6znmFMYjfLM/s935/DSC00858.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-F4GuSoHsPRY/UU444urWxiI/AAAAAAAABsI/UTM56z-ZzlA/s935/DSC00859.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-LBhnSpbUAmo/UU445LBatwI/AAAAAAAABsQ/bOJEM_BEe38/s935/DSC00860.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-F81YmKz2Hsw/UU448Nyoq2I/AAAAAAAABsk/ljMrmYwVZcM/s935/DSC00862.jpg

[loony]

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-kZtZd3Fl75Y/UU448PhwZbI/AAAAAAAABso/thIicdc2M6A/s935/DSC00863.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-LFLcN56Lom4/UU44-VYxPRI/AAAAAAAABsw/RVWZAYzASzw/s935/DSC00864.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-XfQvj4c4WfU/UU44_d3J2CI/AAAAAAAABtA/cQzD3clGrY0/s935/DSC00866.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-a-hUCfgKz7A/UU44_b8UYeI/AAAAAAAABs8/9Dqv2mrBKkc/s935/DSC00865.jpg

And that's all for today... it was 11:00PM, so high time to... eat dinner.
Looks good, but plan was more ambitious... I wanted finish rear section... everything take more time than I thought.

[alga]

It is good progress! To me this was one of the most satisfying parts of the build -- the car-shaped chassis appearing out of nothing.

[loony]

Indeed, it's very satisfying (it was even kind of trance), that's why I wanted to finish it ;) Especially that this week will be busy at work/home, so there won't be time for roadster :(

[loony]

Today's progress (not too much, but always something):

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-d2JzmVmQpt8/UWB8HFfmB3I/AAAAAAAABtg/qhNp370wyoo/w507-h379-p-o/DSC00878.jpg

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-PP2XeQfMRQI/UWB8LQYCvsI/AAAAAAAABto/urIor1WWR7c/s935/DSC00880.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-5eaB8kcbxzQ/UWB8Py83OVI/AAAAAAAABtw/byurfJak96Q/s935/DSC00881.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/--AWB0RqYso4/UWB8Yp67gAI/AAAAAAAABuA/k3_HtDot2J4/s935/DSC00883.jpg

[loony]

With a little help of my friend I brought some donor parts to garage and... my little engine ;)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/--7XCRTYEMY4/UWRjdZU3TbI/AAAAAAAABus/Ds3edAmX1h4/s935/DSC00890.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-lyINKMKwmYA/UWRjh_FHatI/AAAAAAAABu0/mkGQuubkXuA/s935/DSC00891.jpg

I also moved whole build table to have easier access to everything...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-yJxS2bP0hgA/UWRjYxn6DvI/AAAAAAAABuk/pBSraRU5YKc/s935/DSC00889.jpg

[ayjay]

Looking good.

I always tried to do something every day,however small, even if it was only tidying, in order to keep moving forward!

You'll soon be rolling back and to in the workshop going "vroom, vroom"!

[loony]

I always tried to do something every day,however small, even if it was only tidying, in order to keep moving forward!


Small steps, but in right direction ;)

Today I got steering column UJ to fit my Punto II steering rack...

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-RCbd-DJ70FE/UWXYvp9vxsI/AAAAAAAABvQ/leEbF3uxu8M/s935/DSC00894.jpg

The plan is to weld together Sierra and Punto II UJ to make one extended steering shaft to connect Sierra steering column with Punto steering rack...

[loony]

Time for update...
As I'm now unemployed I should have more time for roadster, but... life is cruel and I have to find a job. So... roadster is waiting for it's time.
But I'm trying to do something when I only can.

I bought some parts:
MB 190 radiator...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-sigx-D1qJmA/UZNM4INd7nI/AAAAAAAABxw/t4_YLdXd8P4/w964-h723-no/DSC00937.jpg

Clio header tank...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-n7ATAXOR9-c/Ua9t2WiOT4I/AAAAAAAABzU/X_fBUxTKanE/w542-h723-no/DSC_0027.jpg

Headlights...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-3hsG8Y5L6F4/UbmtW5XsybI/AAAAAAAAB3Q/NG2WjaTvv7U/w964-h723-no/DSC_0054.jpg
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-8VmQ8Y8jmHQ/UbmtXT447pI/AAAAAAAAB3Y/myLhrapDUqQ/w964-h723-no/DSC_0055.jpg

[loony]

I also got my CAD designed laser cut parts:

Paddle shifter to fit Sierra column...
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-kpOTwPIH7ro/UbHnCvluwMI/AAAAAAAAB0Y/iuO3elvJvIg/w964-h723-no/DSC_0035.jpg

Seat brackets...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-rQ-tj3lsaxs/UbHnCxzAPPI/AAAAAAAAB0g/-YOJ3l7hxxM/w964-h723-no/DSC_0036.jpg

And rollbar mounting plates...
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-w7UC1cwVsz0/UbHnDAEbM7I/AAAAAAAAB0c/0rHcoaFDvnw/w964-h723-no/DSC_0037.jpg

[loony]

I shortened oil sump and made sump plate...
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-OwZJZ6WQYoc/UZNNQcR3MrI/AAAAAAAAByQ/jyREps7viYI/w964-h723-no/DSC00942.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-_IQCxPLiQDk/UZRwjy08mwI/AAAAAAAABy0/JaLIQB370G0/w964-h723-no/DSC00945.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-bl9APG-k7e0/Ua9t2j4eRsI/AAAAAAAABzc/89ThEm6EUMs/w964-h723-no/DSC_0028.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-S0jqNlg2S64/Ua9t2rV6rMI/AAAAAAAABzY/kUHbP-otock/w964-h723-no/DSC_0029.jpg

[loony]

I also shortened oil pick up:
Before:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-tU3H3ey_kjs/UbmtYT0R9gI/AAAAAAAAB3k/_1FGuQOzowQ/w964-h723-no/smok+przed.jpg

After:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Asf5Xgxdvgk/UbmtX6rt0iI/AAAAAAAAB3c/d65Rz2SwjZE/w964-h723-no/smok+po.jpg

And last progress - I made suspension breckets:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-E3VSCfBEybI/Ua9t37bXt1I/AAAAAAAABzs/0YB1jDU-1Rs/w542-h723-no/DSC_0032.jpg

In the meantime together with my brother we started making model/plug for bodywork (scuttle to be precise)...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-C4QCrENb8Dw/UZNMmSmmPyI/AAAAAAAABxY/AxPM4EmqtYU/w964-h723-no/DSC00934.jpg

[loony]

First of all, I'm little depressed... I'm unemployed (still), at June 22nd Polish government change the rules of registering kitcars (Alga - you where very lucky ;) ), so my motivation is very low. But I didn't give up as there is always light in the tunnel...

For last few months I did almost nothing.
I welded some harness mounting points, diff plates and that's all.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-a-VH-eXdsE4/UnoEa4OvfuI/AAAAAAAACkc/cOFMI3lEHRc/w964-h723-no/DSC_0059.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-EOu6eA4pyQw/UnoEb_os9PI/AAAAAAAACk0/N8cHarLKDRI/w964-h723-no/DSC_0063.jpg

I was thinking about how to mount upper harness anchor points for use with popular in Poland long 4point harnesses... and I found this:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-MnOeJ89fw7w/UnoEcAAMYAI/AAAAAAAACk4/9F_MtUOrvvo/w964-h723-no/DSC_0152.jpg
Short, 4point, Sabelt road legal harnesses (made in Italy - not cheap "China Top Quality"). So - they are mine - for about £60...
"Formula type" harnesses are very rare in Poland because there are no formula racing series or something. We got only one FIA approved track... That's why I'm so glad of myself.

[flyerncle]

The tunnel is long and the light is faint Lucas,but it is there !;)

[ayjay]

Good to hear you are still going on with your build:)

Every small step gets you closer to the goal.
Just ask if we can help;)

[loony]

Yesterday I picked up pack... No - I'm not a drug dealer ;)

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-lM2kPYPCn_w/UoUn4NbI7pI/AAAAAAAACn4/EJczMFu0Wdc/w964-h723-no/DSC_0165.jpg

As you can read - it's Sodium Carbonate not cocaine (4kg of cocaine would be worth more than my whole Roadster project)
What make me funny - I think in Poland, in my 200k citizen's city, it's easier to buy AK-47 than Sodium Carbonate. There is no such thing like washing soda or similar in the markets... strange country... how people lived without Internet...

Now I can clean my "Sierra stuff"...

[voucht]

Good for you Lucas. You'll see how magic the electrolysis with sodium carbonate is. Just amazing!
Good luck :)

[alga]

Hehe, are are you planning to electrolize your whole chasis? :-) I jused just a couple of spoons of soda for ~30-40 l of water. It was totally sufficient. My 6A battery charger was giving ~4A on large parts such as brake disks. Also, I made Na2CO3 by heating baking soda on the stove. It made a nice volcano-like reaction when steam and carbon dioxide was escaping the powder.

2 NaHCO3 -t-> Na2CO3 + H20 + CO2

P.S. Yeah, Wojciech mentioned to me about the change of rules. But if you just get on with the build, by the time you're finished the new path will be broken.

[loony]

Hehe, are are you planning to electrolize your whole chasis? :-) I jused just a couple of spoons of soda for ~30-40 l of water. It was totally sufficient.


I was ordering from Internet and I need to buy 4kg or 25kg for better value/postage ratio ;) I will sell 1-2kg to my friend who is fascinated with electrolysis for his WWII artefacts...

I was electrolysing my rear brake calipers with salt water - not bad, but soda should be better.

As for rules in Poland - they change it so often (not only registering rules, but everything like VAT, taxes etc.) that this can be truth - so I "keep calm and build roadster" ;)

I have another challenge - to find CDS tube for my wishbones... or even not CDS but in right size/diameter.

[alga]

Try Benteler distributors (previously Helens), they're multinational steel traders. My local branch allows ordering whatever you like with a minimum order of one 6 m length. CDS rollbar, wishbone tubes -- they have whatever you need, with the European quality certificates.

[loony]

I found CDS tubes in 20mm and 26,9mm diameters - maybe not ideal, but close enough ;) And there is hope that I can buy 2,5m of 20mm and 4,5m of 26,9mm - not whole 6m...
I need to ask in one more place in my city - one of the biggest dealer in Poland, but it's definitely wholeseller, so it can be difficult.

Thanks Alga - I will check your sugestion - maybe that's another option.

[alga]

After my crash I had to remake the rear upper wishbone, and friends suggested I remake the lower one too, even though it looks fine and the geometry is unchanged, it might have microfractures that might come out sooner or later. So I bought 6m lengths of the 20 and the 25 CDS tubes. Just a couple months later another local builder bought the 4+2m needed for a set of wishbones, so now I only have 2-3 m or the 20 mm tube left. Having some spare tube turns out useful sometimes, and the two 6m lengths cost me around 300 Lt (360 zł).

[loony]

What wall thickness did you buy ? I get offer for CDS tubes 20x2 and 25x2 and 2x6m should cost around 200PLN... But is it thick enough wall ?

I searched forum and locosbuilders and 2mm wall should be good, but I'm not sure...

[loony]

OK - tubes purchased - 6m of CDS 20x2 and 6m of CDS 25x2. Cost: about £33 :)
I also found metal shop with tube bender, so I can make roll bar...

[alga]

Well done! Re. the roll bar, I found a local rally club that also makes FIA rollcages. They have the tools, the know-how, and the materials to bend the rollbar nicely.

P.S. 2 mm walls is what everyone recommends for wishbones.

[loony]

Nothing special - but always something...
I cleaned uprights...

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Y8TDkPxlwOg/Upo7E4pSWqI/AAAAAAAACq4/OfoKopZ0Ogk/w963-h722-no/DSC_0171.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-JSA1CNtBt64/Upo7FE_RS_I/AAAAAAAACq8/Qaab7dxdmms/w963-h722-no/DSC_0172.jpg

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-YXaTHASlzyM/Upo7GCQtZSI/AAAAAAAACrE/H0TAPh2fI38/w963-h722-no/DSC_0173.jpg

Today - both uprights are painted with primer...

Now it's time for front brake calipers... already in the electrolysis bucket.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-9Y-3A82CYA8/Upo7EwHnBSI/AAAAAAAACq0/iOpnfkzFBAM/w963-h722-no/DSC_0170.jpg

I think I'll change bearings in rear hubs... they are old and it would be easier to electrolyse (?) them without bearings.

[twinturbo]

were the fronts just wire brushed?

That VAT of gunge looks disgusting!

TT

[loony]

Uprights were electrolysed :) Then delicate brushed...
Bucket looks like... bucket of sh... ;)

[loony]

OK - sunday update - 12" fan housing modified to fit MB190 radiator.
It's ready to fix it to radiator, but first I need to check where my engine wants radiator outlets ;)

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-kM-PTUXSqdM/UpthrVehQ2I/AAAAAAAACwE/0ceQy0P1Y2Q/w963-h722-no/DSC_0188.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-2hew0LsgwCs/UptkZx-_6NI/AAAAAAAACwc/8Rn5b9d52WQ/w963-h722-no/DSC_0184.jpg

[loony]

Front calipers (Mondeo MK2 2,5 V6 278mm discs) - painted and ready :)

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-CQIaF8cRCK4/UqBbpQb8m0I/AAAAAAAACz8/WQLNen6bBh8/w963-h722-no/DSC_0199.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-ek3CZC5LpnA/UqBbpSYsxLI/AAAAAAAAC0A/n552jturNds/w963-h722-no/DSC_0201.jpg

[loony]

Maybe you are right, but there is about 5-10mm space between fan and radiator core... so this isn't completly dead area...
Radiator is much bigger than oem kawasaki, so it should be OK. There is always possibility for change in the future either ;)

[alga]

My car has adequate braking power with Sierra's ventilated 240 mm disks. The brakes didn't begin to fade even on a track. Even Caterham CSR has 10" disks. I suspect anything above that is just extra weight, don't overdo it!

[loony]

I hope that with 278mm discs I'll get good F/R brake balance (I have all-disc setup). I didn't have whole Sierra, so... I bought them long time ago. I'll use them and see how it works...

[voucht]

I'm a bit late to the party on this, but just a thought on radiators and fans. The big area in the middle of the fan(where the motor is) acts as a dead area that cool air cannot pass through. So your fan is only drawing air through the area of the 'donut' where the blades spin around. It is common to see fans mounted set back from the rad with a shroud from the rad to the fan to ensure all the air is drawn through the rad and the full surface area is used. On my car I used a Clio rad with a 10" fan mounted 4" behind the rad and a little folded up aluminium shroud to support the fan/duct air.

Hi,

Sorry David, I don't agree with that.

What you say is true if the fan is mounted in front of the radiator. In that case, yes, the motor area completely obstructs the airflow (as well as the, rim, spokes, etc. do).

But when the fan is fitted behind the radiator, the air passes through the core anyway, even on the the motor area (it is not like 100% of the airflow is obstructed but the motor : there are air turbulences there too in this configuration).

If you make the balance between this very small obstruction on the motor area and the loss of efficiency of the fan if it does not touch the core, it is still much more interesting to have the fan sticking as close as possible to the core.

If the fan runs, it means that the engines needs cooling as soon as possible, and it has to be immediately and completely efficient. It will not be if it is not touching the core, because it will be sucking more air coming from between the fan and the radiator than through the radiator (air, like all fluids, always takes the easiest way ;) )

You say it is common to see fans mounted set back from the rad, but I've never seen electric fans mounted 4'' from the radiator, and it sounds way too much to me. Perhaps the "shroud" you are talking about is a kind of air-duct (I didn'd really understand this), in which case it might be OK, but I'm very sceptical about the fan's efficiency if mounted that far from the radiator without no well-sealed ducting.

No bad feelings or nothing personal about that David, it is always hard for me to put the necessary nuances in this language which is not my mother tongue, and I hope I am not sounding offending or anything like that. It is just a different opinion (and only my humble opinion) and nothing more :)

[loony]

That's why I was talking about 5-10mm spacing between radiator core and fan - airflow (air under pressure) will find it's way between fan and core...

On my car I used a Clio rad with a 10" fan mounted 4" behind the rad and a little folded up aluminium shroud to support the fan/duct air.
I think David was talking about air-duct from radiator to fan... so this can work quite well... but as all aftermarket fans are mounted "on the core" - can't be that bad ;)

[loony]

OK - as I have uprights and hubs painted in red primer (in my basement ;) ) I need to decide - should I painted them in black or leave them in primer as this is better than nothing.
But as my car will be black/"kawasaki" green - I think I need to paint them to avoid "harlequin look"...

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-QTknTqIAgyU/UqdEf2ldigI/AAAAAAAAC2I/qiRLt0BzBrc/w963-h722-no/DSC_0211.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-stztKeHo0rw/UqdEf5HTJrI/AAAAAAAAC2M/cbgnUk7liOY/w963-h722-no/DSC_0212.jpg

Sorry for photos quality - my smartphone isn't so smart and have problems when it's dark ;) Color is more red than orange...

[ayjay]

And if you feel a bit hungry:)

Jam sandwich or cheese and pickle;)

[TheArf]

They have been tangoed

Arfon

[loony]

I knew that I get good answer ;)

To make your sandwiches easier - the newest jams are from year 2000, oldest 1996 (and still good and healthy). Can't remember pickles, but can't be newer than 2000 as my parents leave Poland in that year ;) There are some homemade wines as well, so can be happy place.

Back to the roadster - basement is the only place where I can paint and my "second half" don't become mad ;) But during the day I will paint at home, especially that painting with black paint in bad light is really hard.

So - what paint should I use ? Ideally same that I can use for chassis... as I think I will use my red-oxide primer and then some black paint.
Should I use something like Hammerite etc... or find different "epoxy" paint ?

[loony]

As I didn't want to waste time.. I painted uprights and hubs with black hammerite - as I have it at home ;)
Now - they need to dry quickly or I get no dinner today ;)

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-38okAZNg4iQ/UqhjXOWx4XI/AAAAAAAAC3I/_OEk0bwFBAo/w963-h722-no/DSC_0215.jpg

[flyerncle]

Five mins in the oven Lucas with your dinner .;)

[flyerncle]

Another thought on the cooling scenario,if you place the fan on a cowl behind the radiator you are stopping the airflow as it hits the cowl and cant escape freely as the fan is there,the fan is further away but you will have air hitting the cowling and there is no straight path out of it.

A lot of the stuff I repair(Vag) etc the fan is in the front bang up against the rad and no probs even the V6 tdi and RS 6 and the like.

[loony]

Quick update - I installed new rear hub bearings...

Disassembling:
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-46E1kE9H7cs/Uqmm0N2Y9VI/AAAAAAAAC5w/d6mNrSIduAc/w963-h722-no/DSC_0216.jpg

Assembly tools:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-x4eWAcx5V5Q/Uqmm0FfesxI/AAAAAAAAC5s/QBLRsWa2IDM/w963-h722-no/DSC_0218.jpg

Bearings and seals in place:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-WF8xk4Z7TI0/Uqmm181QSnI/AAAAAAAAC6M/Ajsc0_4902o/w963-h722-no/DSC_0221.jpg

Ready:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-WyFLl2JVwIY/Uqmm2BbeVXI/AAAAAAAAC6Q/jvXq_Txkry0/w963-h722-no/DSC_0222.jpg

[voucht]

David, I didn't want to come back on this either, although I wrote a reply this morning that I haven't published. But as I'm not alone in this, well, I can't help myself :p
And sorry Lucas to high-jack your build thread.


If you put something directly in front of the radiator, you will stop the air flowing to the core in that area, conversely if you put something directly behind the radiator air cannot flow out of that area so no flow. Think of blowing down a straw – doesn’t matter if you put a finger over the top or the bottom end when you blow down it either way you still get no flow! Even if the fan is slightly spaced off the back the air needs time to turn to get around the fan.

That is where I think you are mistaken. Anything mounted in front of the radiator will stop 100% of the natural air flow. But anything mounted behind a radiator will not stop it 100%, event if the fan is against the core. I will slow the airflow down for sure, obstruct part of it it with no doubts, but some air will still go through the core there : Why? Because hopefully, the blade's hub (which is +/- the same diameter as the motor), even though it is quite close to the core, is not touching the core! And that is the big difference.
If I take your example of the straw : put your finger in front of the straw, not touching it, but very close (as the blade's hub is not touching the core when you mount the fan against it), and blow: air will not go into the straw. Now, put your finger at exactly the same distance of the straw, but behind, and blow: air will go through it.
The only obstruction you can consider equal in the front and behind the radiator is the outer ring which actually touches the core. but it is so thin that is not a problem.

As I wrote this morning but haven't published, I' might not be an engineer, or the best mechanic in the world, far from it, and I recognize it. I'm certainly the one on this forum who is asking the most obvious and stupid question to you guys who were born with a wrench in your hands. I'm totally aware of this, and I thank all of you for helping me when my knowledge is not good enough for doing what I have to do on the car. That is what a forum is done for: sharing knowledge, isn't it?
So I don't know a lot about welding, exhausts, material resistance and so on... But I have been working for 15 years, (and still am I), for a company which is a specialist of fluid conduction in motor sports vehicles. As you already know, brake lines are part of it. But this company also deals with the other kind of fluids: fuel, oil, water, and air. And perhaps I can share my knowledge about that.
During all these years, I have had contacts with the best companies designing custom cooling systems for motor sports. As most of you are English, I am sure you know them, as most of these companies are English too. I don't want to mane any of them here, because what I say here involves me and only me, but if you know the good ones, they are the ones I am talking about.
These guys are engineers, and they know what they are talking about. For our customers, my company and theirs have studied and designed together radiator + fan assemblies for car racing Le Mans or the Paris-Dakar rally raid to name just a few. And not only one or two. When they were racing in the Sahara, they knew what a hot day is...
But as I said, I'm not an engineer, so I stupidly repeat what I have heard, learnt from them, and read from their literature during the last 15 years. Because my job is to write and edit the French literatures, catalogues (I'm currently working on the 2014 edition), technical files and support for our customers.
So believe me or not, but there is a proven fact that a rear mounted fan against the core is more efficient than a front mounted one. These guys have wind tunnels where they can prove it any time. Which does not mean that a front mounted or a ducted fan does not work. It does work, just not as good as a rear mounted one against the core for the reason I wrote at the beginning of this post.
I can't imagine the engineers of these companies advising a rear mounted ducted fan or a front mounted fan if there is a possibility to put a rear mounted fan against the core. I' have never seen that anyway.

A fan is just an assistance when the car is not in motion or when its speed is not sufficient to allow the natural airflow to extract calories from the water through the tubes and fins of the core. OK, on some applications where there is no or too few natural airflow from the speed of the car, it can work much longer, more often, or even constantly. But it is not our problem with the Haynes Roadster which has a big front opening.

As you say, there are 2 situations
1) Car stationary and fan running
2) Car moving
Ducting the fan on the radiator is considering only the number one. I'm sorry, but yes, the duct will obstruct the air flow more than if there were no duct and the fan mounted against the core. Again, I don't agree with you that it will be better, and that the supposed venturi effect will be even beneficial because an acceleration of the airflow. A venturi is a very specific aerodynamic phenomenon, and I'm not sure a radiator duct has this effect at all. The airflow going through all the outer fins will be slowed down by the duct, to me there is no doubt about that. The consequence of ducting the fan, in the "car moving" situation, is what is called a "charge drop" (I'm not sure this is the proper English term, sorry if it is not, but I think you know what I mean) which is the enemy of any kind of fluid conduction. Ducting a fan on the radiator is considering that the natural airflow will never be enough, and the fan will do most of the job. Of course, that way, the cooling in the “fan moments” will be very good, certainly better than a non-ducted equivalent set-up. But what share of the time does that concern in our situation?
So ducting is very good if there is no, or too little natural airflow from the speed of the car, because most of the cooling will be done thanks to the fan. But if in the normal conditions, the natural airflow is sufficient, which should be on the Roadster, in my opinion, it is another obstruction, and bigger one than the fan mounted against the core. The duct sacrifices the radiator area in front of it in normal use condition (when the fan is not needed), not 100% of it of course, but it does.

I'm not angry or anything, no problem for me. I just wanted to make my point, because I just hope I can help sometimes as well.

Thanks for the attention if you have read this post to the end!

[alga]

I have the Polo 1.1l rad, basically as small as they get. The fan only comes on after ~15 mins of idling in warm weather, or when stopping from a spirited ride. I hung the fan on zip ties through the core, but stuck some window sealer foam tape on the edge. The fan's efficiency is completely fine, it always goes back off within 30 seconds of turning on. I was stuck in traffic in 25°C heat on a couple of occasions, no cooling problems to report.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-eFdAoIMLkIY/USn06-zomqI/AAAAAAAADqk/N6fEtPxw07o/s640/2010-06-24-162710.jpg

[loony]

Back to my build thread ;)
I visited metalshop and had my steering hub turned down (to fit paddle shifter):

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-eCXG6DCDKZA/UtQU9CYY9tI/AAAAAAAAC-Y/1VdmaTF9_Y8/w963-h722-no/DSC_0227.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-brZNmO_oNkg/UtQU9OEpPyI/AAAAAAAAC-U/pGeyYFITzrk/w963-h722-no/DSC_0229.jpg

I also got my pedal bushes...
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-RkWSrm1zq6A/UtQU-fMlCFI/AAAAAAAAC-o/_fSOoijykmc/w963-h722-no/DSC_0230.jpg

Now I can weld my pedalbox.

[flyerncle]

Sylvain,ask what you need to know and dont worry about it,Radiator is all about cooling and heat transfer so a fan behind the radiator would allow the largest surface area to be cooled un-restricted by the fan so more efficient.

[loony]

I trial fitted paddle shifter... that's why I needed hub to be turned down:

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-tBkRMDGXnk0/Uta7kwmEKzI/AAAAAAAADAo/OH8D4Uiok78/w963-h722-no/DSC_0240.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-sx7rmI8Koqs/Uta7k5VM3kI/AAAAAAAADAs/3JUTJ8Y4UMs/w963-h722-no/DSC_0241.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-HiEq0KyGNWs/Uta7mYDiotI/AAAAAAAADBI/YkStOeBjTRs/w963-h722-no/DSC_0243.jpg

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-yiCQKK1cyx0/Uta7miXZvOI/AAAAAAAADBQ/DGdFYOwhORc/w963-h722-no/DSC_0246.jpg

[loony]

I think that spacing between steering wheel and paddles is right...

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-yyb2rQ8D6ZU/Uta7m5Tb_tI/AAAAAAAADBY/njtjqN5xT0A/w542-h722-no/DSC_0249.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-U608rf2HSC4/Uta7nmevjEI/AAAAAAAADBg/07Jby7mJet8/w542-h722-no/DSC_0252.jpg

I'm very proud of myself - because it's my creation, my engineering ;) It only need small final touches (edge smoothing) and little paint on "adapter" as it's steel, but it fits almost like I wanted.

[ayjay]

Its looking good. Great stuff;)

[SeriesLandy]

Looking really good, nice bit of simple engineering with the rose joints but it looks much more complex.

[voucht]

Looks really good Lucas, yes, you can be proud of yourself, very nice work indeed :cool:

[loony]

I'ts been a while from my last post in my build thread, but I didn't give up. There were some complications but now I can continue building my dream car ;)
So - I backed with shopping:
"Second-hand" Speedohealer V4 - I will use bike clocks so it's a must.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/JSeYOKbhjHDlCZ9WYnbk0AqhVx8sq4QnvwGiCwyl4EBOMQsB8n UA-SXrJXzEVhIvbIZNX3S-kJOvVSsfM-rLnOR9_gIwZVV3JnuvGfkyG1y_4eiNVAxHBdGrmc_FnFby0ERf yhv1jHAhsswgD6VjJIaKV0I71m31Mz3Y5N46qMZQHYiYFPPk1S F4zU_eZQrWMOhCS4itO-HJbAdhxf5uB4_b0GeEsX_G4k7UNjjMHsi0i1FpIbaRyARMqYAE dK_rSwuXm-Jqj2B_VbEz3ELp5hahgEOXhBe03RShrHJAVeoUoWkaO7tHGjXS R1IVgzqXP8bSmDAm_-QSCD7i2xzNVyUolvUO1gkDLOgnPbjbE8hlwbHlsBKrVNwPoWCl eMV6WYnYCgzRb0Cez_QB4IR742O5mIJEdp_AM_sbR4SGPwQIni NmE5yAgvZJHOG5g_JS_uLNl9WgpCHssK-nTsf-Bd01ZE_SqYlweIB-iy9Q4ToRyY0X4525bQUXF0G766-uF-qMDlNaX4NoFCBHt6VPibgNhhPBqlmT5jqm6lbJD3c=w908-h681-no
And - something just to make me happy - engine start button:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/eMSFFXQ0GHXV0xi5gItvKYelf851Un6RylUGhUjDkbDEpjEkIc 7ll5WtMiAXmlY4S5qe_a3xt6pa640SBaO00QT8G4s7IFPaC7Ef xJ8hksQ4B4_2DF8ZXhby9kGKefFXJul47z56VZ9SW6BNPtaLqn 7oTZWNZsLSEBirEJUpIAK1FpdP4TJLtjgDv1jYM5cnQKiotkOQ sW9HCx0BEPVTEI_zOaXVLKu-WeJFZ-h7PdlSFcicokM3IEIw3C8C92s0-glK9hFTaTCMFouoQP3Y_J9r0A7LxU4GSQ9EK6G452F3mL-TU2R_HTtD1fE8r1q91grwSXjqiNU8OP51XlGXrUHlewIukRWpa krkjWux6qMSe3ZK1qoBHLXAP8AeDNn-KcTzCYst8xVddTpqmPF07lAbRfJAGNI-4r52OI9cEDGcZkuPH8E3V1wz77Mpor5mQC6cdbiKSBjPih9xzB aJfC0sNi5S1_gXtiP4Jbhi-b-fnxEKj49C1WqMH42x3GDphBz-zD9CkNFeGd9DtQVxkvtxyp1_YMoIxj7FIyPeFCs=w908-h681-no

I know it's not necessary rigth now - but I have feeling that I'm doing something to go on.
Now - I only need some time to continue build... The plan is to weld wishbones and wishbone's brackets and put a car on its wheel by the end of year.

[loony]

I forgot.

In December 2014 I bought Yamaha R1 carbon silencer:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/9vjeb61wejImzGRASF8qTEGliqt46METB9Dt8CNSsK6Fk3jk--YGCJmSVKybUFZPfiDFAKMvHYPHFHI8UpOgb3ixO6Xbf3TWszh3 4s64zhcYhL69FM5bG6eQUARwzSULujPz6zP2360hF1Qu8IYr5t FMU0w6EQSzPA-nczx6Rdp_mI9SnWO2OrY_zaxTr-uoMWeirwhfAzqah7wsm2k8BIhvd6r-6oTGSzDzLb7cE-v0qpcAvJPLVZmUeCRFylU2qQJgsLv0DFiUgVprAEF1Zg9eaQcz iztsO2QDn-IDLfb1djgvCWZD02_rFJFHUznnQ-Ows62q2mJBFdlveQOJLWjcQVLJblE5smKsW25q-EfSVLpGsBlGpTFtaxwMC3Acgpezn5TeDp5xDd1ZtbZjJaNt0JE BwBRojOb6Cti5x5cUYLJJVJoRcHAGpxty9Kn7LoxPrNDEiDuXd a6ZjdZUtn6hPqJurkmFdTFzxNDUwsjMd5YMbVc8QI-rcotDHNhfUS8NmSM4c4UoDdxtQEf3s7kgN2zwASXpRvbuyzINZ fk=w908-h681-no

And in July 2015 I bought rear LED lights ;)
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/hW4AiTHqPUbKdi-FZzBbhPGVq-F8NQ5eFmXOiOUoDBOz6ukdVV-SREbnwBLwssA-REw-Pzc45IPaMUfkEsx8MTN1eYiQpvntNBVuxOtkaCfVZv82DzbEC-5CDH6qWU_yrl5eMkuhr9u8vIi68yPfzk0j2EZIhj8918Su9uKv imh4c-I6tIDHALPqQhIACkGCNDJ_EotL_wGadROmsy_FDgwrLVAum4_M OmZXVRKHt6slM4u5hGfmTOhpqgEVHVARFZPfUQ8udgW_r3QfSJ UhbLitTHItsOx6dYjNhH8ekb8u-ynV27jPD8CW2oSjhho8H8k0u8BIpVtkiYTvMRoobOOW9CRpfVz 9eE0ALj9dpWfxRtzfVuOSSSh27W6VpMm585Hrnjw9RXY4KSwWt efN5nVvEMdSB5xon9FYDMZagK9aq5K1Gi4CblR4a2dk_ZoYFDW lezDy0lp8PKcE7Yt2rsjoHF6D6njUzGQOW8CPT2vtrwq9-eeAfr4lPbvfHnHVqp3TMPysEKetbVTsD5Qke-JUJ7X2sLFe9rA4MqUqwl0=w908-h681-no