2.0 Zetec Turbo Roadster Build
 

Hi all.

Just a little background on myself.

I am a 19 year old man who lives in a smallish village called Rhoose, this is located just 1 mile from Cardiff International Airport. The skills I have acquired i learnt from my older brother and my father. I have always been pretty good with my hands and have always been involved in Motorsport. Since I was a young kid I was always interested in karting, but now i have grown up a bit I have decided I need something more suitable.

After doing lots of reading I have decided that this is the car I want to build. My future brother in law owns an R1 powered westfield which I have spent a fair amount of time in, but after being realistic with myself I soon realised that this was out of my budget range.

I will be building this car to help advertise my business.

My business is called "The Turbo People" and I disassemble, inspect and diagnose, clean, machine, balance and rebuild turbochargers for Fast Road, Performance and Commercial Automotive applications. I also offer a shot/media blasting service.

The car will have business advertisements displayed on it (not to much) but will also be used for personal use on the weekends and sunny evenings, so will need to be road legal.

Before I started reading this forum, I went and downloaded "the book" online. Soon after downloading this I learnt from AshG that (quoted...) ..

"If you like the book and fancy building a car from it maybe you should think about buying the book like the rest of us. I don't want to come across as mean to a new member/builder but the sales of the book are essentially what pay for this nice forum that brings us all together to share loads of information. Also Chris that wrote the book isn't very well and has no income other than the small royalty check he gets every six months. we all love getting things for free off the internet, its great but if the book dies so does the forum."

As soon as the weekend was over I went and purchased the book from "Halfrauds" and spent the next 3 evenings reading through it and preparing my self for what tools I will need and what skills will be required. After having a good old read I realised that I have all of the tools and skills to complete this task. The first thing I did was ring my father and ask him to bring home lots of 3mm sheet and a couple of bits of 5mm sheet, so I could start making the chassis plates.

The pictures are taken in my fathers garage by my younger brother, there will soon be some of my business garage (where the chassis will be put together) next to the westfield.

Not bad for an afternoons work considering all i used was a hand and bench grinder. Pics..









Gotta start somewhere, will continue these tomorrow.

I did take a picture of the log burner i built for my father, but the limit of 4 photos wont allow me to show it.

All the best,

Nick.

Hi Nick,

Good luck with the build, see you're going about it the hard way i.e. cutting all plates from sheet. Have to say laser cutting makes life much easier, so long as it doesnt put you off the rest of the build!!!!!

J

Would have to agree with doing things the hard way then again not every body has access to a £250,000 laser cutter or a guillotine that cuts 3mm sheet.

True. But some things are much easier to buy than make. If I ever decided to do this again I wouldn't even build the chassis, I'd let you do it :-)

J

Second that:(

Hi Nick,
It's good to see a fellow builder on here from Wales I'm in Cardigan and i know David Murray is from Cardiff way and there are a few others.

I must say if you need any help the boys on here are fantastic oh and Mrs Vmax :D

If ever you are up this way call in the kettle is always on.

Regards
Dean

My fathers work has a laser cutter, but he is a lathe operator and finds it hard to find "free time" to go and use it. So the other option is to cut it out manually. Suppose it gives me a much bigger sense of achievement.

Decided to tackle CP3 & 4 today, but after completing them and sitting down with a beer looking back over my work. I realised that I have done something wrong. Or at least I think I have done something wrong? I made 2 x the diagram. Although once I laid them out on the floor, they didn't line up once side by side. I think I should have mirrored the diagram? Can someone confirm that this is what I have done wrong?

If that is the case at least one of them will be of use and one as a spare.



Cheers.

Thanks for the offer Dean. Will have to take you up on that once its all built and up and running!

Decided I am just going to cut these nuts off and weld up the holes. Want to weld my roll bar in place.

Cheers.

Hi Nick and welcome to the forum and the wonderful orld of Haynes builders. I only really have one comment for you at the moment and that is buy some safety goggles and gloves for goodness sake:D . Its too late when you've lost a finger or an eye. Well done with making the chassis plates by hand.

D.

Hi Davey,

I was wearing goggles when using the grinder as seen in picture 1, and then the bench grinder has a sheild fitted already.

Going to cut those nuts off when i get home later on and just weld the holes up. As i said last night i am going to just weld the roll bar into the car. Much stronger that way.

Hi Nick, yes you were wearing goggles in the first pic, well safety glasses anyway but the shield on te grinder is flipped back so as much use as an ashtray on a motorbike and in none of the pictures were you wearing any skin protection. I'm trying not to sound like an old woman here (probably not succeeding either:D ) but personal safety in the workshop is something you start to realise is a good thing as you get older. I trust you are fully covered up when welding?

D.

I found ear protectors are also useful when using the angry grinder. They make cutting a lot less tiring.

Davey - Yeah I have my own elbow length welding gloves. Things are great!

alga - Yeah my father brought me some some ear plugs and they really helped, although the radio ended up blaring (without realising) and I was constantly when my mother asked what I wanted for tea. haha!

I ground those nuts off from those plates tonight and welded the holes back up and ground them level again. All I need to do is make and weld the suspension mount to them and they will be finished and another pair ticked off the list.

If i can get these made tomorrow after work before going to the girlfriends, I should be able to put some pictures up for you all.

without sounding like i,m teaching grandma to suck eggs :o

just take your time with the upper suspension bracket on the underside of the plates, as you have already found, its quite easy to get the positions mixed up etc , being left & right side of the car etc .

Thought I,d add this, with ref the brackets for these plates......if welded in the wrong position it often doesn,t become apparent until you try to fit the rear shocks & by this time you have already welded the CP3/CP4 "boxes" to the chassis & so it makes it hard work to cut the brackets outs , I,ve seen it happen too ( not on my build )

I agree with the other guys...safety is sooooo important, but its easy to take it for granted UNTIL it goes wrong :eek: ;) , stay safe & enjoy the build .

cheers
andy

Cheers Andy,

Yeah i will take extra time when marking out where the bracket goes. Check and double check before welding up.

Hopefully will have some pictures later on tonight with some progress.

I'll second that - despite checking several times I still welded one of my plates in the wrong way round and couldn't get the top shock bolt in :rolleyes:

On the PPE side of things, I'm sure I was once told it was a really bad idea wearing gloves when using a bench grinder :confused:
Something to do with the chance of the gloves getting entangled and dragging your fingers in with them...

Great start though, keep up the good work :)

Right have just got home. Going to mark out on the plates where I think the brackets should go and post a pic up to confirm they are in the right position. I can picture in my mind where I think they should go. Might be wrong, soon see.....

Bumped into a problem already.

Looking at this diagram..



You can see that RS15 which is 19x19 sits against the suspension mounting bracket. After measuring it out, I found that this is not the case and don't understand where I have gone wrong? .. Following the diagram I checked that RS15 was 19x19. Next after following the diagram to see which side RS15 went on, I measured 19mm down the one side, this has been marked with a scriber as you can see in the pic below. These are accurate measurements.





Next I used the diagram at the top to place a pop mark to show the centre of the bracket. This is also accurate as I have checked many times.

I then checked the spec of the suspension mounting brackets and saw that they were 40mm wide. So from the pop mark i measured 20 both sides. As you can see from the close up of the ruler, there is a gap between 0 and the rs15 mark.

Does the bracket actually sit against RS15? Or is it just a misleading diagram?

Cheers.

Nick,

don,t worry you are NOT going wrong, its the diagram;)

Rather than take the measurement from the side face of RS15 to the center of the SHOCK absorber bracket, its best to use the 97mm from the base line & 48mm from the side line of the plate.....

don,t use RS15 as a guide, as you have found its quite easy to come up with conflicting measurements even tho in the end it does work out, but I would suggest that anyone doing this for the first time is to ignore the RS15 part.

The shock bracket does not touch RS15 when in the correct position, the bottom cad picture of page 173 you,ll just see that there is a small gap between the two parts .

also, don,t miss that the RS15 part sits 3mm lower from the TOP edge of the plate as this is the position that part CP6 then sits flush against the end of RS15 & creates the "box " effect that you are making out of all the plate parts.

The bottom edge of the diagram once turned over ( when the box is made ) sits on top of part SB2...........
I,ll explain ...
CP3 is 150mm .....RS15 is 122mm....3mm gap for part CP6.....and the 25mm of part SB2 = 150mm.

The diagram is a little misleading until you actually make the make the parts, but this also may help...........the dimension sketch from page 173 ( as in your post above ) is in fact for the NEARside of the car but needs to be turned around so that the bottom edge becomes the top edge when placing on top of the SB2 part..........this is where the diagram is confusing :eek: :confused:

I hope this helps, its not easy to write down & explain.

cheers
andy

Hi Andy,

Thanks for your reply. Very easy to understand what your saying. Can picture it in my mind as reading it.

Just to confirm, this is the 3mm gap you was talking about?



Also, on the part where you said .. "its best to use the 97mm from the base line & 48mm from the side line of the plate"

Going from the previous pictures i posted of the plate, with RS15 down the left side, is that the position the plate should be in to follow your measurements above?

Also, following your measurements, does that pinpoint the top left corner of the bracket?

Hope this makes sense.

Had a spare hour tonight so made the 4 brake line mounts and the 2 radiator mounts :)

Cheers.

Hi Nick.

yes thats the 3mm gap .

The description I have given above is using the sketch dimension drawing from page 173....

BUT

that sketch drawing is to be viewed as if you have Xray vision :eek: :confused: ...basically you are looking THRU the top of the plate with the RS15 & shock bracket UNDERNEATH the top plate ( hope that makes sense ).....this is the nearside box for the car. the offside is a mirror image / handed etc .

The measurements I have given will pinpoint the CENTER of the shock bracket.

An easy way to do it is ignore RS15 for the moment, scribe out a line 97mm across the plate from the base line ( using that diagram remembering its to be scribed UNDER the top view of the plate ) then scribe a line upwards 48mm from the side edge, this will then give you the center point of the shock bracket.

Once you have this done, then place RS15 under the top plate on the left hand side as you view it from above , remembering the 3mm gap at the top edge , this should then leave you 25mm between the bottom edge of the plate & the RS15 part ( this is for the SB2 part once you place onto the chassis frame ).

does that help ? remember this is making the NEARside box.

cheers
andy

Andy,

That is spot on. Know exactly what I'm doing now. I noticed the edge of RS15 is in line with the plate, they meet edge on, do I weld along this edge to join them up? Not sure if something meets that face that's all.

Finially,

For the shock and normal brackets ( 85 shock and 16 normal)

What thickness is the material used for these? Doesn't say in the book.

Actually looking back over my couple of pictures, the center point i have marked looks around right? from memory there was over 20mm (cant remember exactly) what it was.

So using my pic with the ruler on it. i just need to drop the top left corner (RS15) down 3mm. and mount the bracket using the measurments you said. and then i have the near side done? Then just mirror / hand it to the other side?

Sorry. Making this more complicated than needed now :D

yes you got it ;)

there are 8 shock brackets & 16 wishbone brackets in the car, use the diagrams on page 184 making sure you use the correct measurements for the shock or wishbone brackets ( the wishbone brackets are described in the book as STANDARD SUSPENSION BRACKETS)....don,t get these mixed up as I,ve seen the wrong brackets welded in place before & its a nightmare to cut them out later on in the build ;)

the brackets are made from 3mm plate as shown on page 184;)

glad my posts have helped .

cheers
andy

Cheers mate. Very helpful.

Forgot to say in my last post. As i have mine laid out, the RS15 on the left with 3mm gap at the top, then the bracket mounted to said position. I am mounting these ontop of my plate arn't i and not underneath (looking at my pic)

I can feel satisfaction already just from almost finishing all the plates :rolleyes:

Built a BMW R45 into a trike last year, that was good fun! Great satisfaction there :)

as you are not drilling the 4 holes for the roll bar mount then yes you can weld the parts as described on the top of the plate but this first one then becomes the OFFSIDE box , ( in your mind imagine turning them over so the bracket & RS15 is underneath ) as long as you mirror / hand them you,ll be ok .

Just wait till you feel the satisfaction of having a rolling chassis that YOU have created :cool:

cheers
andy

ps.... the RS15 part is welded to the very outside edge of the plate , then later on part CP7 is welded down its side so to speak.

I understand. So just weld the parts ontop as i described, then mirror and hand them on the second one, turn them both upside down and I have what i need?

Sounds better than i thought.

Oh right. So once I have RS15 tacked in place, I cant seam all the way around it like I will be doing with the bracket?

yes , you "got it" :)

I would suggest that you fully weld the bracket to the plate BEFORE welding the RS15 part, as its easier to get the welding torch/shroud around the bracket if RS15 is not in the way,

then

weld the inner face of the RS15 part (close to where the shock bracket/ top plate is ) leaving the outer edge & ends free of welds .....as these area,s have other parts that need putting very close to eachother, it,ll all become clear as you get further into the build up of the chassis ;)

cheers
andy

I completely understand what I'm doing and how to approach now. There should be more details in the book on this section.

Thanks for all your help Andy. Hopefully My father can bring me home some 19 x 19 and I can finish these CP3 & 4. Want to get the rest of the plates made.

You,re very welcome :)

if you can,t obtain 19 x 19 then 20 x 20 will be ok as long as you are aware of the extra mm & cut / position accordingly ;) .

I look forward to seeing your build progress :cool:

cheers
andy

Thanks again mate.

You certainly are "HandyAndy".

All The Best.

Progress soon...........:cool:

Small update..

Haven't been able to make much progress over the last week. This is because I have been extremely busy with work, also had to do a gearbox change on my friends car. Hoping that over the next week I can start to finish off the plates and look at getting the steel ordered!

Spent a couple of hours yesterday and managed to complete CP18 x4 (seat mounts) and get the nuts welded into place too. Weld's are not completely clean as the nuts I welded on had some kind of Zinc coating on them to stop them rusting. I ground these off before i welded and also buzzed over the plate before welding so i have 2 clean faces, but i think there must be a small reaction with the metal in the nuts to the metal of the plate. Either way it aint too messy and wont be falling off.

Pic...





Also after making a thread called "Chassis Nut and Bolt List" i managed to find out the different sizes and lengths of the nuts, bolts and washers for the suspension and the diff.

My father was able to bring these home from work with him tonight, i only gave the list to him last night! :cool:

There is more than enough plus plenty of spares.. Also got him to bring me home some more grinder disks.



In the pic above is...

- 10 grinder disks
- 32 M12 8.8 bolts
- 54 nylock M12 nuts
- 78 M12 Crimp nuts
- 211 M12 washers
- 20 M10 normal nuts
- 20 M10 Crimp nuts!

Just need to order the 2 x diff bolts, 2 x upright bolts, and the head/nut caps now and I should have all the bolts I need.

I noticed after reading IVA that you need to use nylock nuts to stop them vibrating loose. Well these are great but can only be used once or they end up loose, also the nylon can melt in temp conditions and also come loose. Was hoping to use these crimp nuts. The last few threads in the nut has a slightly smaller pitch making it like a crimp, so cannot come undone form vibration and can be used as many times as possible. Would this pass IVA?

They are Zinc coated so are rust resistant the same as stainless ones.

Cheers.

No offence meant or intended but it looks as though you have fully threaded bolts on your picture,for suspension and shocker applications and other stressed parts partially threaded bolts would give more security,if you think of every root of the thread as a failure point you can see what I am getting at.

What I am seeing in the picture are Set Screws - these are threaded their whole length. Bolts are similar but are not threaded the whole length. It is important when ordering supplies that you specify the correct item as flyerncle says a Set Screw will have inherent weakness when used in certain applications.

Thanks for your input guys. I will see what else i can find today. Will keep these bolts for other parts of the car.

From memory these are called k nuts and were originally for aerospace use.Personally i would use suggest using normal nuts when test fitting parts and then use the nylocs for the IVA as i dont know about the inspector being able to tell the difference,use the k nuts for manifolds etc.
Another thing to note also is your bolts need to be rated as 8.8 tensile strength and BZP bolts have a higher strength than the equivelent stainless ones.

Exactly where does this idea that Nylocs are single use come from? I've been re-using nyloc nuts for 30 odd years and never known one to come loose. In the motor trade it is not normal practice to fit a new nyloc nut every time one is undone, we simply refit the old one.

D.

Thanks Guys.

Someone advised me to use shoulder bolts instead of set bolts, so got my father to bring me home what I needed.

60's and 80's. For the 70mm ones i will just have to cut 10mm thread off. Not a problem.

Pic..





Davey: I have just noticed that once they have been on and off a few times, they dont have such a tighter fit as when they were new.

Ozzy1: All bolts i use will be 8.8 tensile. Pic above ;)