Fabricated front uprights

[Balidey]

I have asked this question on the 'other' forum without getting a definite answer.

Basically, I want to use Cortina front uprights. These seem to be getting harder to track down, and fetching good money. And about 4 years ago there was some discussion by someone called Rorty about fabricating some Cortina pattern front uprights from lasered and welded parts and a bolt in stub axle. Which really appeals to me. But since those initial posts it seems no one has really made any.



We accept the fact that the rears are fabricated, so surely the fronts can be too.

But this leads me on to think about instead of fabricating an upright to match the Cortina geometry and have to modify the Book wishbones to suit, why not fabricate front uprights to replicate the Sierra uprights with the top location built to not have to use the mushroom inserts.

I have access to materials, laser, presses and I although I can weld, I am hoping to get onto a proper welding training course soon.

So, throwing this out to the jury, why shouldn't this be done? I want to scratch build as much as I can, and fabricating front uprights seems like it should be possible. The only thing I have not managed to do is find someone thats already done it.

[flyerncle]

Nothing to stop you making your own and nice drawings,is it not easier to buy them already made with the right geometery and I would think much cheaper in the long run.
Dont get me wrong I am not peeing on the bonfire,anything to make life easier.

[londonsean69]

Weren't there lightweight alternative made by a firm? Raceleda springs to mind.

If they can do it, then there is no reason you can't, assuming correct design/materials/fabrication etc.
I think that the forces involved in the front uprights are 'probably' higher than those in the rear. The rear is basically a glorified hub carrier/suspension pivot. The front also has to take the cornering forces.

Flyerncle is right about the cost/hassle factor. I did see a set of cortina uprights on Eblag for £50 the other day, no idea what they ended for.

Sean

[flyerncle]

I could not remember, but Raceleda one's are the dogs bits and easily available. About £300 possibly.

[Talonmotorsport]

The light weight uprights as in the cad drawings are used in grass track specials and heavily modded class 5+7 saloons. www.drdracing.co.uk/Chassis_Components.php These are £40 each plus ally escort type hubs £40 each. So question is if there that cheap why make them?

[Balidey]

Cheap is a relative term when I plan to scratch build almost everything.
£40 each upright, plus £40 each hub, plus about £15 postage.£175.
Cortina hubs are about £80 to £100 a pair.
Sierra ones about half that, but requiring mushrooms.

From what I have read the best uprights to use are the older Triumph design, but again are harder to find and fetch more money.

Fabricated uprights will cost time only as I have use of materials, laser, mill, lathe, welding, blasting. And I can tailor them to give me the geometry I need.

What I hadn't seen is any evidence of fabricated items, but those links above for the autograss ones confirm that they are made, and I have seen the abuse that some og those cars get so I am more than happy to attempt to make my own. I think.

And the 'hassle' factor shouldn't come into it, it should be the 'fun' and 'rewarding' factors. Isn't this why we build cars? not to have hassle, but to enjoy the process of it, and to save some cash too.

And the smaller items I can make (uprights, wishbones etc) I can tackle sooner, where are the chassis is going to be harder to hide from my wife

[flyerncle]

Having followed the Talon link and looking at what they offer, and then reading Balidey's post I can see the logic in his thought's and the fact that he can say "I made this" makes a lot of sense.
I for one would be interested in fabricated and rose jointed uprights at Budget cost, with engineering expertise close to hand and the time and equipment to use it would not be difficult as Balidey says.
Hiding the chassis however is another matter.
Out of interest Ford now only have one side available new for the Sierra upright at £154 so they will become a rare item in time,If the new Haynes toy requires the same parts and reading between the lines maybe not, we may be looking for more bits from the old Sierra.

Good luck with you build Balidey

[londonsean69]

Originally Posted by Balidey

Cheap is a relative term when I plan to scratch build almost everything.
£40 each upright, plus £40 each hub, plus about £15 postage.£175.
Cortina hubs are about £80 to £100 a pair.
Sierra ones about half that, but requiring mushrooms.

Don't forget the bearing kit at £13 a side
Or they can come as part of a donor Sierra (I'm actually buying the bits as I go). I got my Sierra hubs for £40 delivered. The mushrooms I am in the process of making.

Originally Posted by Balidey

Fabricated uprights will cost time only as I have use of materials, laser, mill, lathe, welding, blasting. And I can tailor them to give me the geometry I need.

Fair enough, but that means it should also be easy to make Mushrooms.

Won't you have to buy bearings for them as well?? They are getting pricey for Sierra ones. Although if making from scratch you could design in any easily/cheaply available bearing.

Originally Posted by Balidey

What I hadn't seen is any evidence of fabricated items, but those links above for the autograss ones confirm that they are made, and I have seen the abuse that some og those cars get so I am more than happy to attempt to make my own. I think.

Here are some more;
Ally - http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=1375_1594_1595&products_id= 11815
Steel - http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=1375_1594_1595&products_id= 13605

Originally Posted by Balidey

And the 'hassle' factor shouldn't come into it, it should be the 'fun' and 'rewarding' factors. Isn't this why we build cars? not to have hassle, but to enjoy the process of it, and to save some cash too.

Maybe hassle is the wrong word, but there are definitely certain things that I would buy in if I were to do it again, unless I had better tools. Case in point is the inserts. My tiny lathe is making them, but for £50 a pair would the several hours it has taken so far been better spent doing something else??
If you have access to bigger/more industrial tools then fair play, go for it, lucky git

Originally Posted by Balidey

And the smaller items I can make (uprights, wishbones etc) I can tackle sooner, where are the chassis is going to be harder to hide from my wife

I'm doing the same. I have cut a lot of the chassis plates, made wishbones etc. and am actually leaving the chassis till a bit later in the year. It too hot in my garage to be welding in summer!! Tacked a few brackets last week and was dripping!

I would be very interested to see a finished set

Originally Posted by flyerncle

Out of interest Ford now only have one side available new for the Sierra upright at £154 so they will become a rare item in time,

Christ, they are £90 a pair at Rallydesign

Sean

[londonsean69]

These might also be of some interest/help to you

http://groups.google.com/group/locos.../uprights-hubs

It's a collection of DXF and DWG files for the locost, mainly uprights, hubs and suspension parts - including the cortina hub and upright, ball joints, etc

It's from a link on the locostbuilders forum

Sean

[Balidey]

Thanks for that link Sean, just what I was looking for.